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Author Topic: Nice Philippus Caesar from TOMIS  (Read 1112 times)

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Offline gb29400

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Nice Philippus Caesar from TOMIS
« on: October 07, 2006, 04:42:21 pm »
Hi all,

this 27 mm and 12,94 g brass came in my collection.

M.IOV :Greek_Lambda:  :Greek_Phi: I :Greek_Lambda: I :Greek_Pi: :Greek_Pi: OC KAI, CAP AV :Greek_Gamma: (beneath)
Bare-headed draped and cuirassed bust of Philipp right, facing bust of Sarapis left, wearing kalathos.

R/ MHTPO -   :Greek_Pi: O - TOV TOME :Greek_Omega: C
Nike holding palm and wreath walking right.



Guy

Offline slokind

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Re: Nice Philippus Caesar from TOMIS
« Reply #1 on: October 07, 2006, 04:55:45 pm »
Not half so nice as yours, the Sophia specimen AMNG I, 2, Taf. XXI, 36: p. 911, no. 3595.  One of the loveliest (and best struck) Tomis coins I've ever seen.  Regling counts it as a  :Greek_Delta: <, though these are not marked, other than by the two busts.  Pat L.

Offline areich

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Re: Nice Philippus Caesar from TOMIS
« Reply #2 on: October 07, 2006, 04:56:26 pm »
'Nice' is an understatement.
Andreas Reich

Offline Jochen

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Re: Nice Philippus Caesar from TOMIS
« Reply #3 on: October 07, 2006, 05:16:11 pm »
What a wonderful Nike!

Offline dougsmit

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Re: Nice Philippus Caesar from TOMIS
« Reply #4 on: October 19, 2006, 12:01:53 pm »
That is an extremely nice reverse die!   I'll show ignorance here:  Why do you consider this a Caesar coin when it is clearly marked  AV :gammavar:

I note what I have called an Augustus coin from Marcianopolis also has bare head but moved the Caesar part of the legend to the start of the legend:


Just in case anyone is not familiar with the "..and a half" coins Pat mentioned, I'll tack on an image of a marked Tomis 1 1/2 (>A).  I would be interested in the theory behind calling the coin a 4 1/2 rather than a 5. 



Doug


Offline slokind

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Re: Nice Philippus Caesar from TOMIS
« Reply #5 on: October 19, 2006, 01:52:51 pm »
I don't know whether anyone has spelled it out more fully than Regling did in AMNG I, 2.  What it comes down to is that Tomis, having a minting tradition from Hellenistic times, carried over its own denomination nomenclature, perhaps even weight standards, loose as those are for copper alloys, into its Imperial coinage.  Count Soutzo had speculated in perhaps excessive detail already along these lines.  I didn't get the French volume on the Soutzo collection at Costantza that appeared a year or so ago, and therefore do not know whether it re-examined these questions.  The basis of the halves is that the unit of the semi-autonomous coins at Tomis is, as I recall, 1 1/2 the preceding Hellenistic unit in bronze.  I'll go check.
Maybe PScipio, who has been studying the semi-autonomous small bronzes, will know.
Pat

Offline slokind

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Re: Nice Philippus Caesar from TOMIS
« Reply #6 on: October 19, 2006, 02:58:09 pm »
Regling is much wordier than Pick, but I do have in universally openable RTF format my running partial translation of his account, two pages with source pages interspersed, of as much as wasn't too detailed for such treatment.  I can send this as an attachment to anyone who wants it.
The long and short of it is that R. found greater consistency in weights and measures at Tomis than Pick found in the middle of Moesia Inferior; it did require averaging a goodly number of coins.  The A< the  :Greek_Gamma: and the  :Greek_Delta:< are obviously related by doubling.  A as such doesn't occur, nor does the E of Marcianopolis, et al.  The B and the  :Greek_Delta:, as such, have to be regarded as more like the other cities' B and  :Greek_Delta:.  See attached denomination chart.  Regling was also concerned to ascertain whether  :Greek_Delta:< really was larger (D. and Wt.) than  :Greek_Delta:, and not, as seems to be the case elsewhere, almost wholly dependent on the obv. type (two heads) and the rev. mark.  The second attachment shows what he concluded.
Only Gordian and Tranquillina coins underscore the four-and-a-half value by marking it; Regling found the Philip & Otacilia and the Philip & Serapis issues to be consistent.  Ergo.  (The one, no. 2734,  for Septimius antedates the system, I think; anyway, it is the glorious one with a great Herakles reverse, very rare--still so, I think, and the obv. die looks at least as early as Barbarus issues elsewhere).
Possibly one of the German members who also owns AMNG would like to refine and expand my account; as I said, I can send by e-mail the RTF doc. that I made to send to friends about five years ago.
P.S. It is convenient to print out the scanned attachments here "to fit the media", i.e., enlarged.

Offline Pscipio

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Re: Nice Philippus Caesar from TOMIS
« Reply #7 on: October 20, 2006, 12:05:34 pm »
The basis of the halves is that the unit of the semi-autonomous coins at Tomis is, as I recall, 1 1/2 the preceding Hellenistic unit in bronze.  I'll go check.
Maybe Pscipio, who has been studying the semi-autonomous small bronzes, will know.

I know that the average weight of the small hellenistic bronzes from Tomis backs up that theory, but unfortunately, I wasn't yet able to get the Soutzo volume, so I can't tell what it says. Lately, I've been focussing on pseudo-autonomous coins from Asia minor, so Tomis got a bit neglected.

Lars
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