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Author Topic: Desert Patina cleaning Project, step by step !!  (Read 49677 times)

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Offline Salem Alshdaifat

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Desert Patina cleaning Project, step by step !!
« on: May 22, 2010, 01:11:11 am »
Dear Forum
yesterday  I had a call from a friend who asked me to show him how to clean Desert patina coin  step by step, and he is lucky that I have some that I just got and didnt clean yet :)
first here is the befor and after photo .
and then I will post step by step the cleaning method.

Offline Salem Alshdaifat

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Re: Desert Patina cleaning Project, step by step !!
« Reply #1 on: May 22, 2010, 01:34:29 am »
Before starting, put the coin overnight in DW TO MAKE THE DIRT SMOOTHER .   [ADMIN Note: DW = distilled water]

Step 1:
Start shaving the high points on the coin

Step 2:
Don't point the tool down or push down, push like shaving just at the high points and the edges of the details.

step3:
Start shaving from down the edges to the up, never go from up to down, you might remove some of the sand patina .

step 4:
Shave the letters around.

step5:
Remove heavy patina (dirt) where you see it is realy thick.

step 6:
Remove the dirt from the edges to give sharper details and contrast to the coin.

step 7:
Clean the inside edges to make contrast to the letters.

step 8:
Clean between the letters to make them sharper.

then you will get this beauty  ;D

best regards.
Salem


Offline Randygeki(h2)

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Re: Desert Patina cleaning Project, step by step !!
« Reply #2 on: May 22, 2010, 02:20:34 am »
great post, awsome coin

Offline Jochen

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Re: Desert Patina cleaning Project, step by step !!
« Reply #3 on: May 22, 2010, 02:47:18 am »
Impressive. Thanks for sharing it.

Jochen

Offline renegade3220

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Re: Desert Patina cleaning Project, step by step !!
« Reply #4 on: May 22, 2010, 08:54:59 am »
What are you using for a tool?

Offline casata137ec

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Re: Desert Patina cleaning Project, step by step !!
« Reply #5 on: May 22, 2010, 09:27:24 am »
Awsome, Salem! Thanks! Now to see about making this sticky...

Chris
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Re: Desert Patina cleaning Project, step by step !!
« Reply #6 on: May 22, 2010, 09:49:40 am »
This is the same method that I use.  Let me add one thing - this should be done under magnification, preferably under a binocular microscope. 
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Ghengis_Jon

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Re: Desert Patina cleaning Project, step by step !!
« Reply #7 on: May 23, 2010, 10:03:40 pm »
The two steps that cannot be over emphasized:

(Joe):   Do it under magnification.  If you can't see what you're doing, you're bound to screw it up.  A steady hand will only take you so far.

(Salem):  Shave/scrape from down to up.  Mistakes/slips are FAR less damaging and FAR less frequent going in this direction.  It doesn't matter what tool you're using (pin/pick/scalpel), always down to up.

Offline Robert_Brenchley

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Re: Desert Patina cleaning Project, step by step !!
« Reply #8 on: May 26, 2010, 03:34:27 pm »
What's the tool?
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Offline Dino

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Re: Desert Patina cleaning Project, step by step !!
« Reply #9 on: May 26, 2010, 03:58:45 pm »

step3:
start shaving from down the edges to the up, never go from up to down, you might remove some of the sand patina .


What do you mean by down to up?  Are we talking from low points to high points or from edge to center or from the bottom of the coin to the top?

And what kind of tool is that?

Offline Dino

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Re: Desert Patina cleaning Project, step by step !!
« Reply #10 on: May 26, 2010, 04:00:33 pm »
Also, do you let the coin dry or is it wet?  Do you need to wet it again as you clean?

Offline Salem Alshdaifat

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Re: Desert Patina cleaning Project, step by step !!
« Reply #11 on: May 26, 2010, 08:05:30 pm »
The tool is Dental tool, I sharpen it till it is realy sharp.

The down to up : when I clean the coin I make the direction of the tool from low area to high area, this way I know for sure that I wont by mistake take more desert patina than what I should, and it is the same as from the edges and sides to the center.

wet or dry : as bigginer I advice you to use the wet method till you are sure you can do the job without scraching the coin or removing extra dirt.

by time your hand will work realy by it self and will know the way, you always have to shave the coin, dont push the tool hard, and dont push at curves or between letters.

best regards.
Salem

Offline otlichnik

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Re: Desert Patina cleaning Project, step by step !!
« Reply #12 on: May 27, 2010, 08:45:50 am »
Shukran Salem.  I have tried this several times based on the information you and Kevin previously posted and comments from others but I have never been able to get good results.  These directions add more details so I look forward to trying them (though sadly I am in the process of packing my coins up for a house cleaning-rental-posting abroad process and won't be able to spend much quality cleaning time until I am re-united with everything in October).

Does everyone use a dental tool and if so sharpened?  What do you use, Joe and Ghengis Jon??  I tried the unsharpened dental pick as in Kevin's older posts and could not remove enough dirt.  I tried scalpel and removed too much.

Likewise, Joe and Ghengis Jon, do you do the whole things under bino microscope, or just the details?  I do all my scalpel/x-acto work under microscope but have never though of using it for "Desert Patina".

Finally, as a related question, why do you find almost exclusively black patina under the desert dirt but, conversely, rarely find black patina under other types of dirt?  Chemical? Heat related??

Shawn

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Re: Desert Patina cleaning Project, step by step !!
« Reply #13 on: May 27, 2010, 09:34:17 am »
I use a scalpel, the surgical kind.  I believe these are much better than exacto blades.  I work under a binocular microscope.  Under the scope if I accidentally scratch the coin, when I pull it out from the scope, the scratch usually isn't visible because it is smaller than the period at the end of this sentence. 

We have had a few posts explaining the chemistry of different color patinas but I can't remember what they said.
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Re: Desert Patina cleaning Project, step by step !!
« Reply #14 on: May 27, 2010, 12:07:55 pm »
I use binocular googles and a modified wood vice for most of my cleaning work.  For the minute detail work I use a bino microscope available to me at my employer over the weekends.  I don't own a professional numismatic company like Joe so I can't really justify the expense of buying one.

I use a dental pick for most detail work.  I sharpen the picks as needed with a 1/2 hp Craftsman Bench Grinder, which is a lot faster than a file or whetstone.  A pick will take 2-3 sharpenings before they must be discarded.  For 95% of coins that have dirt or soft encrustations, I find that a nylon brush and dental pick is sufficient.

I use an exacto knife for the heavy or thick encrustations.  Basically the rough work.  Its much easier and cheaper to replace the blades as they get brutalized than to replace a scalpel. 

A scalpel is the most effective tool.   It is not something that can be effectively sharpened and therefore is simply replaced when dulled.  But when you're getting down to a very thin layer of encrustation or field work, a scalpel cannot be beat.  There are two primary styles of scalpel available - straight edge and rounded.  I find the rounded to be the most versatile. 

Don't ignore other tools like diamond dusted scrapers or Dremel tools.  Each has their place.   Applications using these, however, would be a whole new threadHope my two follis helps.


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Re: Desert Patina cleaning Project, step by step !!
« Reply #15 on: May 27, 2010, 12:10:36 pm »
By the way Salem, your cleaning skill rocks!

Offline Salem Alshdaifat

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Re: Desert Patina cleaning Project, step by step !!
« Reply #16 on: May 27, 2010, 01:59:40 pm »
I use a black stone to sharpen the tool, but it has to be realy sharp, some times I have to sharpen it twice to finish one coin, when it is not sharp it wont go smooth on the coin surface , and it wont do the shaving, when I say shaving I mean the word, it is the same as using a blade and shave your face, and as you use your skills not to cut your face you have to do the same with the coin, by the time mistakes will be very little .
best.
Salem

Offline otlichnik

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Re: Desert Patina cleaning Project, step by step !!
« Reply #17 on: May 27, 2010, 03:18:14 pm »
Scalpels. 

I have only ever used exacto blades.

What scalpels do people use?  Plastic or metal handled?  There appear to be two grades of blades.  I have seen the first called "floor grade" and the second "operating theatre grade".  Which of these blade grades is better?

Shawn
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Offline Salem Alshdaifat

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Re: Desert Patina cleaning Project, step by step !!
« Reply #18 on: May 27, 2010, 03:35:21 pm »
Dear Shawn
I am not familiar with those tools you mentioned, I use a dental tools, my brother in law is a dentist , and I get the tools from him, and sharpen them.
best.
Salem

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Re: Desert Patina cleaning Project, step by step !!
« Reply #19 on: May 27, 2010, 07:46:56 pm »
I just ordered one of these tartar scrapers from Amazon.  Looks like Salem's.  Only four bucks.

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Re: Desert Patina cleaning Project, step by step !!
« Reply #20 on: May 28, 2010, 12:36:02 pm »
I will re-experiment with the DP coins with both sharpened dental pick and scalpel when I get the chance.

But my scalpel question was aimed more broadly.  I do all my difficult cleaning, including silvered coins, with x-acto knife and if people say results from scalpels are better I would like to try actual scalpels.  I am just very curious about type - handle, blade quality and blade # - that people use.

Anyone know where the thread explaining the black patina under the DP is?  Or if there is one?  I searched a few ways but all I could find are threads on that annoying thick black patina, more of a crust, that obscures details.  I couldn't find anything explaing why coins are black under DP.

Shawn
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Re: Desert Patina cleaning Project, step by step !!
« Reply #21 on: May 28, 2010, 09:40:07 pm »
I use this type of blade.  I have a few different handles.  I don't think the handle matters much.  I bought a few hundred of the blades and use a new one often.  The handles and blades are availble from Amazon.
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Offline Mayadigger

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Re: Desert Patina cleaning Project, step by step !!
« Reply #22 on: May 30, 2010, 10:53:49 pm »
Ave!

I use this type of blade.  I have a few different handles.  I don't think the handle matters much.  I bought a few hundred of the blades and use a new one often.  The handles and blades are availble from Amazon.

Joe, same here, but I prefer this curved blade, rather than your flat blade. For me, anyway, the curved blade is much easier to deal with...and much more forgiving in inexperienced hands.

Best,

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Offline Mark Z

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Re: Desert Patina cleaning Project, step by step !!
« Reply #23 on: May 31, 2010, 01:06:22 am »
Kevin,

As a hack cleaner, I agree that the curved blade is a godsend. In fact, since your great advice in another thread, I have had great success and a lot more pleasure from my latest batch of uncleaned coins.

mz

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Re: Desert Patina cleaning Project, step by step !!
« Reply #24 on: May 31, 2010, 02:33:59 pm »
I have tried the curved blades and for me the straight blade is easier.  I work mostly near the tip and the straight blade has a very narrow small tip, so I can be very precise.  I think whatever works best for the user is fine, of course. 
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