Classical Numismatics Discussion
  Welcome Guest. Please login or register. 10% Off Store-Wide Sale Until 6 June!!! Explore Our Website And Find Joy In The History, Numismatics, Art, Mythology, And Geography Of Coins!!! Expert Authentication - Accurate Descriptions - Reasonable Prices - Coins From Under $10 To Museum Quality Rarities Welcome Guest. Please login or register. 10% Off Store-Wide Sale Until 6 June!!! Explore Our Website And Find Joy In The History, Numismatics, Art, Mythology, And Geography Of Coins!!! Support Our Efforts To Serve The Classical Numismatics Community - Shop At Forum Ancient Coins

New & Reduced


Author Topic: Question on Pedigree??  (Read 3097 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Jerome Holderman

  • Caesar
  • ****
  • Posts: 1630
  • My name is Jerome, and I am a coinaholic!
Question on Pedigree??
« on: June 23, 2004, 08:21:15 am »
I was wondering, at what point does it become appropriate to note Pedigree on a coin. For Example, if you purchase a coin from Forvm, or HJB , obviously that is worth noting, and  if you purchase one from Joe Shmoe on E-bay obviously it is not. But what about the in betweens? Fairly noted E-bay sellers. Or Notable collectors such as Heather Howard or Henrik Agdal? Would these be noted? What about slightly less noted E-bay sellers, or dealers? So far I have not done a real good job of keeping track of where all my coins came from, but am curious as to how othes handle these issues?

thanks
Jerome

plmurphy

  • Guest
Re:Question on Pedigree??
« Reply #1 on: June 23, 2004, 08:36:27 am »
Jerome,

I am not sure what is the traditional way of giving pedigree to coins but I know that with military medals they are normally given a pedigree depending on the collection that they came from. The assumption is that the experienced collector knows more about his subject than dealers. The exception is where it has been in a specialist auction, eg. Spinks or Sothebys, otherwise the delaers are pretty much ignored. I presume that something similar applies in the coin world ?

For my own collection I keep a note of where I buy each item but aspire to being one of those collectors that bestows pedigree in the future. With medals I am getting there but with coins I have a lifetime of knowledge to catch up on before I am even close !

Paul

TKE96

  • Guest
Re:Question on Pedigree??
« Reply #2 on: June 23, 2004, 08:40:08 am »
I do try to keep track of where they came from, how much paid, etc.

If I bought it from a dealer who includes the flip insert, I usually leave that inside my flip insert.  If I make changes in an attribution, I definitely note that...

Offline Robert_Brenchley

  • Procurator Caesaris
  • Caesar
  • ****
  • Posts: 7307
  • Honi soit qui mal y pense.
    • My gallery
Re:Question on Pedigree??
« Reply #3 on: June 23, 2004, 09:02:48 am »
I always note the source, date and price on my flips, together with any other info I have on provenance. The one exception is uncleaned as I lose track by the time they're fit for putting in flips.
Robert Brenchley

My gallery: https://www.forumancientcoins.com/gallery/index.php?cat=10405
Fiat justitia ruat caelum

Offline Jochen

  • Tribunus Plebis Perpetuus
  • Procurator Monetae
  • Caesar
  • *****
  • Posts: 12016
  • Omnes vulnerant, ultima necat.
Re:Question on Pedigree??
« Reply #4 on: June 23, 2004, 09:02:58 am »
Hi!

I'm very interested in the history of my coins, where they come from and so on. They all are part of a long history and not fallen down from heaven. So I'm very glad if I can attribute it to a special collection or collector. But that's not easy! I have only few coins with a small pedigree. Often the dealer is not willing to say more than, it came from a friend of Croatia, or I have it from a well-known collector in Luxembourg, but the name I can't tell you. I think that is not satisfying, but what can I do? I have some coins with wild stories about their origins, but I think these all are fairy-tales! From auction-catalogs I knew, that a coin with an interesting pedigree is much more worth than without!

Regards,
Jochen

Offline curtislclay

  • Tribunus Plebis Perpetuus
  • Procurator Monetae
  • Caesar
  • *****
  • Posts: 11126
Re:Question on Pedigree??
« Reply #5 on: June 23, 2004, 11:28:40 am »
    Jerome is talking about prestigious pedigrees.  It's nice to know that your coins come from famous collections, e.g. Hall, Ryan, Jameson, Trau; or were acquired by exchange from a museum, say BM; or were in a high-quality sale such as Ars Classica, Leu, Triton.  I don't think such a pedigree has much effect on the price of a coin, however, except in the case of the Gonzaga eaglet.
     For a scholar who wants to include your coin in a study, however, EVERY known detail about its provenance is important, in order to eliminate possible double counting of the same specimen, and especially if the provenance indicates a probable findspot.  For example it's important to record that your coin came from a Bulgarian supplier, however humble, because that means it was probably found in Bulgaria!
Curtis Clay

Offline Jerome Holderman

  • Caesar
  • ****
  • Posts: 1630
  • My name is Jerome, and I am a coinaholic!
Re:Question on Pedigree??
« Reply #6 on: June 23, 2004, 12:32:51 pm »
I guess Provenance might have been a better word for what I was asking. I think Curtis Clay has hit the answer I was looking for . In that the details only matter to a scholar including a coin in a study. Which although unlikely in my case , is something that I had not previously considered. And is probably reason enough for me to try keeping better track of these details. After all I hopefully have a long life ahead of me so maybe by the time I am old and gray I may have a noteable collection of interest to someone? Stranger things have happened. LOL

Offline featherz

  • Procurator Caesaris
  • Caesar
  • ****
  • Posts: 553
  • All Elagabalus provincials to me, please! :)
    • Aeqvitas.com
Re:Question on Pedigree??
« Reply #7 on: June 23, 2004, 09:18:54 pm »
I generally only list provenance on my website if it's someone most people would know - a famous collection or collector or a high end sale such as Triton (I only own one Triton coin, my temple of Vesta denarius). :)

Of course, sometimes it's hard to tell. I just bought a coin 'lakeview collection' and I have no idea whether that's worth mentioning or not. :)

Offline slokind

  • Tribuna Plebis Perpetua
  • Procurator Monetae
  • Caesar
  • *****
  • Posts: 6664
  • Art is an experimental science
    • An Art Historian's Numismatics Studies
Re:Question on Pedigree??
« Reply #8 on: June 24, 2004, 02:55:42 pm »
Whether a four-digit-price coin or not, it may be useful to record, e.g., ex-Lindgren, or any other collection or auction dispersal which makes your specimen definitely a "known" specimen.  In some cases (admittedly not the majority) RPC might be glad to know what is, or what is not, a new one.  Matching a good digital photo with a re-print of an old photo of a cast is not always easy.   Also, as someone else said, when I receive a coin with an old owner's card in the flip, I keep it behind my own.  Not an "issue" to do so, sure, but why not?
Pat L.

 

All coins are guaranteed for eternity