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Author Topic: Lucius Verus limes AE denarius with double strike  (Read 1202 times)

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Offline timka

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Lucius Verus limes AE denarius with double strike
« on: May 21, 2016, 07:08:46 am »
Hi!

I have read in earlier threads that AE limes denarii are all casts. Yes, most them look like casts....

...but have a look at this AE denarius with double strike on obverse - so, is it a cast of silver denarius with double strike? or it could be a minted AE denarius, as double strike implies minting, not casting?

2,4 g -18mm - 180'

Thank you,

Z.

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Re: Lucius Verus limes AE denarius with double strike
« Reply #1 on: May 24, 2016, 11:29:06 am »
Fascinating.  I believe that the cast limes falsa were made by pressing originals into a clay which was then fired to create a mould. 

I wonder if you could get the "double-strike" effect by pressing the original 'master" coin down into the clay twice?  A slight shift between pressings?  Or if it could only come from using a double struck denarius?

Shawn
 
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Offline okidoki

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Re: Lucius Verus limes AE denarius with double strike
« Reply #2 on: May 24, 2016, 11:51:25 am »
this core is copper then two halves of silver are struck on i believe, so is core is struck one could have a double strike?
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Eric
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Offline timka

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Re: Lucius Verus limes AE denarius with double strike
« Reply #3 on: May 25, 2016, 03:36:50 am »
Hi Shawn, Hi Eric, Thank you for your comments!... I got no clue about reasons of this double strike. I also believed that double strike could not appear on limes AE denarius, until I got this one.

Eric, there is no core, or overlaying silver there.... this coin is homogeneous

Offline okidoki

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Re: Lucius Verus limes AE denarius with double strike
« Reply #4 on: May 25, 2016, 10:50:56 am »
Hi Shawn, Hi Eric, Thank you for your comments!... I got no clue about reasons of this double strike. I also believed that double strike could not appear on limes AE denarius, until I got this one.

Eric, there is no core, or overlaying silver there.... this coin is homogeneous

the silver plating is gone, the core is left and that core was struck if i remember correctly
All the Best,
Eric
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Online Jay GT4

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Re: Lucius Verus limes AE denarius with double strike
« Reply #5 on: May 25, 2016, 11:10:32 am »
Quote from: okidoki on May 25, 2016, 10:50:56 am
Hi Shawn, Hi Eric, Thank you for your comments!... I got no clue about reasons of this double strike. I also believed that double strike could not appear on limes AE denarius, until I got this one.

Eric, there is no core, or overlaying silver there.... this coin is homogeneous

the silver plating is gone, the core is left and that core was struck if i remember correctly


This isn't a fouree but a limes denarius

Offline okidoki

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Re: Lucius Verus limes AE denarius with double strike
« Reply #6 on: May 25, 2016, 11:13:29 am »
limes is same as i remember same way made?
only limes more or less official
or am i mistakes here?
All the Best,
Eric
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Online SC

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Re: Lucius Verus limes AE denarius with double strike
« Reply #7 on: May 25, 2016, 11:55:43 am »
A fouree is struck.  It is counterfeit of a precious metal coin made by striking a base metal version.  It was plated in the precious metal either before or after striking.  Fouree denarii are most common but there are fouree gold coins too.

A limes denarius is cast.  It is made in base metal from moulds made from original coins.  I don't know if most were ever silvered.  Does anyone know of evidence of any being silvered?

There are other limes falsa too - cast sestertii, dupondii and asses.  The originals used tend to date from 2nd to early-3rd century. 

Shawn

   
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Offline okidoki

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Re: Lucius Verus limes AE denarius with double strike
« Reply #8 on: May 25, 2016, 12:07:27 pm »
ah thank you Shawn, i was with the idea that limes were also plated because they are called limes denarii

here are my limes plated fouree
https://www.forumancientcoins.com/gallery/thumbnails.php?album=5729
barbarous imitations
https://www.forumancientcoins.com/gallery/thumbnails.php?album=5728
All the Best,
Eric
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Online Jay GT4

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Re: Lucius Verus limes AE denarius with double strike
« Reply #9 on: May 25, 2016, 12:10:31 pm »
I don't know if they were ever silvered.  I have a few which more or less look like very tarnished silver but I don't want to clean them for fear of what will be underneath!

Offline Joe Sermarini

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Re: Lucius Verus limes AE denarius with double strike
« Reply #10 on: May 25, 2016, 04:10:50 pm »
Fascinating.  I believe that the cast limes falsa were made by pressing originals into a clay which was then fired to create a mould. 

I wonder if you could get the "double-strike" effect by pressing the original 'master" coin down into the clay twice?  A slight shift between pressings?  Or if it could only come from using a double struck denarius?

Shawn
 

I believe double pressed into the clay to make the mold is the most likely explanation.
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