Numismatic and History Discussion Forums > Ancient Coin Forum
Tips on Attributing Philip II Staters?
Henry S:
Hi, I'm totally new to this so bear with me. I have a Philip II Stater that I'd like to identify and attribute on my own to see if I can find the correct catalog number, mint, era, and other details. Is there some sort of general guide somewhere? So far I have been "brute forcing" it by going through auction archives.
My stater has only a trident beneath the horse and no other identifying marks. I know I could post a photo and someone could tell me the exact Price # but I'd like to try to do it myself from scratch. It seems like there's 2 mints: Pella or Amphipolis, and at least 2 major eras: posthumous or not. Any tips on how to tell which is which? The only thing I've noticed is that Pella mints horses farther apart with the front hooves at different heights while Amphipolis seems to mint the horses closer together and with the front hooves lined in an upward cascade.
Amphipolis also mints more horse reigns it seems but this may be anecdotal. I understand dies wore out quickly and each one was handmade so it may very well be I never find my exact coin in a catalog, but any tips to help me attribute would be great, thank you!
Virgil H:
I understand your desire to identify it yourself. I try to do the same thing and then sometimes ask for confirmation here depending on how confidant I am. And, over time, you get much better at it. Have you looked at Wildwinds.com yet? That is a great site run by a Forum member and you can look at examples of specific mints, rulers, etc. Also, the American Numismatic Society has great resources and great search tools. One thing I do is use Wildwinds to get into the ballpark. Be sure you also look at the text files associated with the coins as they often have more info than the description. I always use the version with thumbnails and scan the photos to start.
Good luck!
Virgil
Altamura:
Try PELLA: http://numismatics.org/pella/results
This should contain all types described in Le Rider's book "Le monnayage d’argent et d’or de Philippe II", Paris 1977:
Regards
Altamura
Henry S:
Pella was not as useful to me for this Phillip II stater simply bc most of the Le Rider dies lack pictures. However, they did let narrow my search in auctions. After seeing some remarkably similar dies, I think my coin is either a Le Rider 291, 300, or 338.
The closest coin is this https://www.acsearch.info/search.html?id=801757 a "Le Rider Pella II; cf SNG ANS 268" - Is there an online resource for SNG ANS or Le Rider Pella II?
Also while some sources broadly say that my coin is likely minted at Amiphipolis, I disagree. Based on the position of the horse's front legs I think they're more similar to Pella minted Philip II staters.
If anyone has tips for narrowing my search for the dies/Le Rider # of my coins please feel free to chime!
Thank you
Altamura:
--- Quote from: Henry S on June 24, 2022, 08:33:41 pm ---... simply bc most of the Le Rider dies lack pictures. ...
--- End quote ---
If you want to go down to the level of dies you probably have to look into the book of Le Rider (which is to my knowledge not available online :-\).
--- Quote from: Henry S on June 24, 2022, 08:33:41 pm ---... Is there an online resource for SNG ANS or Le Rider Pella II? ...
--- End quote ---
The collection of the ANS is to a large extent online too, SNG ANS 268 is this coin: http://numismatics.org/collection/1944.100.12205
But the ANS collection is also one of the sources of PELLA, so this coin ist in PELLA too.
But SNG 268 looks different than your coin and also different than the coin in your acsearch link (where you should be aware that the descriptions of dealers are not always correct :-\).
So again, for dies you probably have to look into the book :).
--- Quote from: Henry S on June 24, 2022, 08:33:41 pm ---... Based on the position of the horse's front legs I think they're more similar to Pella minted Philip II staters. ...
--- End quote ---
Do you know the exact criteria for the attribution of these coins to one of these mints (I don't)? If not, then this is mere speculation, "more similar" perhaps being a weak argument :-\.
Regards
Altamura
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