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Author Topic: bronze republic coins........  (Read 3165 times)

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romeo

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bronze republic coins........
« on: September 17, 2008, 01:59:12 pm »
you know when you just know the question you are about to ask is so obvious or just plain stupid but....
why are there so many silver republic coins out there but so few bronze? the market seems to be flooded with them,
i have a very large collection myself some of which i will be selling soon, but im a bit concerned that because there are so many and seem so widely available, that maybe the republic coin market has been flooded with fakes. im pretty good at spotting the fakes but after looking at my collection (about 300 republic coins) they all seem genuine, so either they are getting very good at faking or im really bad at spotting them lol. anyway im getting off the point, why are there not more bronze republic coins about?

Offline PeterD

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Re: bronze republic coins........
« Reply #1 on: September 17, 2008, 02:18:11 pm »
There just weren't that many bronze coins issued. None at all were issued after 82 BC until the reign of Augustus. On the other hand vast quantities of silver coins were produced during civil wars when armies had to be paid.
Peter, London

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romeo

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Re: bronze republic coins........
« Reply #2 on: September 17, 2008, 02:45:55 pm »
so excuse my lack of knowledge on this one but how did the lower class manage, surely no economy can survive without a broad range of currrency? do you get my point or am i talking dribble? :laugh:

Offline PeterD

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Re: bronze republic coins........
« Reply #3 on: September 17, 2008, 05:47:09 pm »
The Roman monetary system was a bit slow off the mark, compared with the Greeks. In Republican times the economy was not completely moneterised. Smaller transactions would have been via barter.
Peter, London

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romeo

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Re: bronze republic coins........
« Reply #4 on: September 18, 2008, 02:46:30 am »
oh i see, many thanks for that ;D

Offline Robert_Brenchley

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Re: bronze republic coins........
« Reply #5 on: September 22, 2008, 03:31:42 pm »
For that matter low-value copper coinage was a late starter in England. Copper farthings don't appear till the reign of James I. With the Industrial Revolution, combined with agricultural reform, many people found themselves cut off from the old small-scale rural economy, which must have been largely barter-based, and this forced a large-scale monetisation of the small-scale economy in the late 18th and early 19th Centuries. There was a severe lack of small coin, and this led to a flood of copper tokens being issued unofficially by businessmen. The completely monetised economy we're familiar with today seems to have been quite a recent development.
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Offline Gilgamesh

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Re: bronze republic coins........
« Reply #6 on: November 01, 2008, 11:24:56 pm »
The Romans did come late to coinage. Weighed out bronze was the initial medium of exchange resembling coinage. Bronze did figure in their first foray into actual coins. Around 326 B.C. their first coin, a struck bronze, was issued by Naples (cr 1 Ob.head of Apollo, Rv forepart of man-headed bull). This is due to the Romans beginning to push their influence into southern Italy, requiring some medium of exchange acceptable to the Greeks. Their second issue, around 300, was also a struck bronze cr 2 Ob.head of Minerva, Rv man-headed bull)possibly also issued by Naples.

When they began seriously issuing currency around 280, bronzes figured prominently with silver didrachms, mostly based on souther Greek standards. Silver with struck and cast bronzes were issued in number during the episode with Phyrrus (280 - 272) and during the first Punic War (264 - 241)/ Regular issues of silver and bronze continued down to the great reform around 211 (during the middle of the second Punic War). The bronze, far from being relatively rare, was the standard i.e the as.

The post 211 struck bronzes - as, semis, triens, quadrans, sextans, uncia, semuncia and, briefly, quartuncia - continued to be issued in quantity until the middle of the second century. We begin to see a dropping off in the issuing of bronzes following the destruction of Carthage in 146. The following period is one of growing wealth and power among the aristocracy who ran the state as a oligarchic business. The Roman state issued currency to finance their budgetary needs (primarily warfare and building) and the aristocracy were the primary beneficiaries of these activities.

Looking at this overview, the relative shortage of republican bronzes is not apparent until post 140's. We need to look for reasons other than shortage of issue.

The widening gap between rich and poor from the 140's offers an explanation for this period only. The aristocracy simply didn't care that there was a shortage of bronze currency; they didn't need it and they didn't care if the poor did. This shortage of bronzes is mentioned by the annalists and we only need to look at the history of internal conflict during this latter period to understand that the shortage of bronze coinage was one symptom and, perhaps one factor, of the social malaise that led to the destruction of the republic.

The reason for the relative scarcity of surviving bronze against silver for the earlier period? Look at the pieces themselves. Large and of good metal. They held their value for centuries and many literally circulated for centuries, becomming slugs or little more than. These poorer pieces can be bought at low prices comparable with similar size imperial issues. Better quality surviving specimens are rare. They were never hoarded like the silver. They show up in some hoards; isolated pieces. Individual pieces, lost when new or relatively new are found with metal detectors.

It is possible that many pieces, whether in identifiable condition or mere slugs, would have been melted down in imperial times.

Anyway, your question is an interesting one, not dribble. The republican bronzes are a much understudied issue. I have been making some small effort to study these bronzes and hope to have time to do more in the not too distant future when I am able to travel again and see major collections. Unfortunately there is little published material to build on compared to the coverage of the silver. My own collection of around 1200 republican bronzes, about 600 of which are ases, is a useful hands on resource and I have most of the published material but, unfortuantely, time is still a little scarce and my brain doesn't seem to work quite as well as it used to.
Every day I know less and less about more and more. Soon I expect to know nothing about everything.

 

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