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Author Topic: Strange Julia Domna denarius with mirrored DIANA LVCIFERA reverse  (Read 1566 times)

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Offline Jan de Veen

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In a Dutch language forum on Ancient Coins someone posted images of a strange denarius that was included in a sizable lot of ancient coins which he has recently purchased.

I will post the images below. It is a Julia Domna denarius of the DIANA LUCIFERA type as struck under Caracalla  (RIC 373A, Roman Silver Coins 32, Sear 7100) but with a strangely mirrored reverse...
Size is 18mm, weight 3.35g.




Here is a normal denarius of that type from Wildwinds:


Please be assured that the image of the reverse is not an accidentally mirrored image. The coin actually looks like that in hand!

The owner of the coin as well the other participants of the Dutch forum (myself included) would be interested to hear the opinions of the members here. Has anyone ever seen anything quite like this? Is it likely to be an ancient imitation? A modern forgery? Was it cast or struck? If it is likely to be ancient, what circumstances could possibly have caused this major mistake?

For comparison we have also mirrored the image using photo imaging software, to show what the reverse of the coin would have looked like had the reverse been cast/struck in the more correct manner:



Some features (like the torch) still look odd when displayed like that, but the legend now appears (more or less) correct...


Offline Pscipio

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Re: Strange Julia Domna Ant with mirrored DIANA LVCIFERA reverse
« Reply #1 on: May 18, 2008, 06:45:12 am »
It's a fourrée, an ancient plated fake with an AE core. These often do not copy the official types correctly.

Lars
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khingila

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Re: Strange Julia Domna Ant with mirrored DIANA LVCIFERA reverse
« Reply #2 on: May 18, 2008, 06:48:38 am »
It is not unusual to find a contemporary imitation reversed in this way (usually referred to as "retrograde"). This happens when the engraver copies exactly what he sees on the prototype coin into the copy die without realizing that everything has to be copied in the negative for it to come out correctly in positive on the struck coin. Sometimes it may be that it was just too difficult. Try writing your name backwards, for instance. One also sometimes finds individual attributes reversed, such as a palm branch in the wrong hand while everything else in normal.

--Dave

Offline Jan de Veen

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Re: Strange Julia Domna Ant with mirrored DIANA LVCIFERA reverse
« Reply #3 on: May 18, 2008, 07:14:29 am »
It is not unusual to find a contemporary imitation reversed in this way (usually referred to as "retrograde"). This happens when the engraver copies exactly what he sees on the prototype coin into the copy die without realizing that everything has to be copied in the negative for it to come out correctly in positive on the struck coin. Sometimes it may be that it was just too difficult. Try writing your name backwards, for instance. One also sometimes finds individual attributes reversed, such as a palm branch in the wrong hand while everything else in normal.
--Dave

Yes, I have seen mistakes like that on contemporary imitations before (with the odd object or letter in retrograde position), but thus far never one where the entire reverse was mirrored...

Offline Goodies

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Re: Strange Julia Domna Ant with mirrored DIANA LVCIFERA reverse
« Reply #4 on: May 18, 2008, 11:58:13 am »
Quote
This happens when the engraver copies exactly what he sees on the prototype coin into the copy die without realizing that everything has to be copied in the negative

Some irregularities can be seen in the reverse when the coin is mirrored (see below) especially the arms/hands and the torch look very awkward.

 :)
Lx

khingila

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Re: Strange Julia Domna Ant with mirrored DIANA LVCIFERA reverse
« Reply #5 on: May 18, 2008, 12:37:49 pm »
He seems to have missed the I in LVCIFERA which coincidentally is very weak on the official example. It should come as no surprise that counterfeiters were often neither particularly literate nor especially skilled.

 

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