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Author Topic: This tibit about Julian II  (Read 2019 times)

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Offline ecoli

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This tibit about Julian II
« on: June 14, 2006, 10:59:08 am »
The Orthodox and Catholic Churchs retell a story concerning two of his bodyguards, who were Christian. When Julian came to Antioch, he gave orders to sprinkle all the food in the marketplace and all the water in the wells with blood from idol worship. This would have left the Christians in that town with nothing to eat or drink without violating their beliefs. The two bodyguards opposed the edict, and were executed at Julian's command. The Orthodox Church remembers them as saints Juventinus and Maximos..

Does it have any contemporary source?  It just sounds too much like a scary bedtime story than history.

Offline Heliodromus

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Re: This tibit about Julian II
« Reply #1 on: June 14, 2006, 12:44:02 pm »
I agree that it sounds very unlikely - more likely Christian propaganda to discredit Julian.

Julian's religious policy was very tolerant - he passed laws allowing freedom of religous practice.

Ben

Offline DruMAX

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Re: This tibit about Julian II
« Reply #2 on: June 14, 2006, 01:02:15 pm »
Everything I have read about Julian is that he did not persecute christians...more he tried to give a boost and revival to the pagan...

I have never heard this story or read it in the books I have read about Julian II. Not saying it isnt true...

Offline Dapsul

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Re: This tibit about Julian II
« Reply #3 on: June 14, 2006, 01:12:05 pm »
This story is an invention of John Chrysostom, in his eulogy of the two saints. According to the historically more reliable Libanius (orat. 18,194; 15,43; 12,84f.), the two officers had conspires against the emperor and had planned to assasin him. Sounds mor likely.

Frank

Offline ecoli

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Re: This tibit about Julian II
« Reply #4 on: June 14, 2006, 01:26:03 pm »
According to Libanius, Julian was assasinated by a Christian in his camp, instead of a battle wound; is that to be believed as well?

Offline Dapsul

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Re: This tibit about Julian II
« Reply #5 on: June 14, 2006, 01:56:00 pm »
There is such a lot of diverse informations and a bulk of mystification about the death of Iulian - what to believe? Libanius was a friend of the emperor and a hater of the Christians. It is neither unlikely that his account is correct nor that it was an invention against the Christians. Sozomenos said that God was angry on behalf of Iulian and therefore sent the devastating earthquake of 363. If this was a common view, why shouldn't a Christian kill him?

gavignano

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Re: This tibit about Julian II
« Reply #6 on: June 24, 2006, 04:14:51 pm »
Interesting posts. It brings up the never ending question, who to believe?
Libanius and Julian regularly not only exchanged pleasantries, but formal correspondence. It is quite interesting that no other (comtemporary) historian mentions the death of Julian via a Christian.
Hmmm...
Can we know more? Is the bodyguard story a fabrication? It is quite fantastic, but at that time, the Pratorian had Christians among them who would die for their beliefs...so its not impossible.
This would make a great movie, no???  Tom Cruise could play Julian,,,, ;D

Offline ecoli

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Re: This tibit about Julian II
« Reply #7 on: June 24, 2006, 08:55:55 pm »
Tom Cruise would need more facial hair...if Julian's coins are to be believed  ;D

gavignano

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Re: This tibit about Julian II
« Reply #8 on: June 24, 2006, 10:24:47 pm »
Hey ecoli - now you are onto another tidbit about Julian - was he really as hairy as his coin portraits? Seriously, I have read he wanted so much not to look Christian, that he purposely had himself depicted as bearded, as no one since before Constantine had done. I am referring to his Augusti offerings of course.
BTW, Tom Cruise grew a heck of a nice beard for his portrait of a Vietnam veteran in Born on the 4th of July. He looked quite Julinaesque even. Joe

 

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