FORVM`s Classical Numismatics Discussion Board
Numismatic and History Discussion Forums => Medieval, Islamic and Crusader Coins Discussion Forum => Topic started by: mikepellerin on June 04, 2006, 10:38:30 am
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I've just begun collecting Medieval Coins and am really new to it all, so sorry if my questions are a little simplistic.
At what point does a coin stop being Ancient and is considered Medieval? Subsequently, at what point does a coin become Modern?
I hope as my knowledge base increases to be more of a contributor to this board, than just a reader.
Thanx in advance...
:wreath3dot: ==Mike== :wreath3dot:
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At what point does a coin stop being Ancient and is considered Medieval?
There is no one answer for that question. You must first define "medieval"...and some people have spent their entire academic careers doing that (or trying to!).
A standard, text book answer for the start of the medieval period is 476 A.D. (last Roman emperor in the western empire) and a popular date for the start of the modern times is 1517 (Martin Luther and his 95 theses).
"Many (or most) people do not think of Constantine being a medieval king, but I (and many other medieval historians)date the start of the middle ages in the fourth century. One specific date that I could argue is 330 A.D., with the founding of Constantinople. You could also date the end of the middle ages as 1453 with the fall of Constantinople (and the end of the Hundred Years War)- how is that for convenient ;D"
http://victorclark.proboards55.com/index.cgi?board=improvement&action=display&thread=1147295717
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In Numismatics some consider the fall of the Roman Empire the end of the Ancient period and therefore beginning of the Medieval period. The fall of Constantinople to the Ottomans is considered the end of the Medieval period.
But there are so many different opinions about it.
To indirectly quote Fawzan Barrage (moderator of the Islamic Coins Group and the Medieval Coins Group), who said that each religion or region goes through their own periods, is one that I personally favour as well. Which would mean that the rise of Islam with the Umayyad Empire may be the medieval period for Christian Empires but the Ancient period for Islamic empires and so on. You get the picture.
However on ebay and on other sales sites Crusader (although Crusader coins are within the Mevieval period, they are still a whole different category on their own) coins are also considered Medieval coins and even coins from the 17th and 18th century are considered Medieval coins.
I personally draw the line at the point where coins started to be machine struck and were not hammered anymore. This is where generally the line is drawn between "Ancient Coins" and "World Coins" at www.coinarchives.com and on a big venue site where Forumancientcoins is also a member.
So as a general guidance it would be 1453AD when the Ottomans conquered Constantinople. Thats the line between Medieval and Modern period. The fall of the Roman Empire around 480AD is the end of the Ancient Period.
But important is what you think, because it is your collection. The good thing about your collection is that you are the boss.
Best wishes,
Burak
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Yes, Martin Luther's 95 thesis is often also considered as the border between Medieval and Modern but sometimes you also read or hear the border to be the invention of the printing press in the 1450s as well (Gutenberg)
Best wishes,
Burak
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I'd plump for the printing press myself. The Reformation would never have happened, at least in that way, without printing.
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I'd plump for the printing press myself. The Reformation would never have happened
Without the Renaissance, the Reformation might not have occurred, though!
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To add another year: In Germany most often the end of Medieval Times and the beginning of the Modern Times is connected to the discovery of America by Columbus AD 1492.
Best regards
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In Germany most often the end of Medieval Times and the beginning of the Modern Times is connected to the discovery of America by Columbus AD 1492.
1492 is also important for another reason- Spain finished the Reconquista with the capture of Granada. This unification of Spain and end of fighting freed up money which funded Columbus and New World exploration.
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Oh, that was new for me!
Best regards
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I think a lot of things were happening at once; better communications, oceanworthy ships with enough capacity for sustained trade, printing, the Reconquista, and so on. One very important consequence was a political and religious upheaval in Northern Europe.
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To add another year: In Germany most often the end of Medieval Times and the beginning of the Modern Times is connected to the discovery of America by Columbus AD 1492.
Best regards
In Italy we use 1492 too. However you should consider, as Burak said, the place. About the coinage: Zeno eastern coinage is still "roman", but he struck in Rome follis of 40 nummi, that are "medieval".
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I think you are right if you say one must consider the place. First such changes of cultural times are mostly not revolutions but happened more evolutionary. So it is only the demand of men to fix it to a special date for convenience. Then you should bear in mind that these processes don't happened synchronized but at different times at different places. So you can see in Europe at the same time f.e. Renaissance, Baroque and even Romanesque.
And if you think in global criterias you realize that today some people still live in medieval times or even in the time of stone age. A fact that leads to global problems nowaday!
Best regards
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In reallity the best strategy that you can use is considering a certain event that passed in your country and that could be considered the element of border between periods. This aspect is simple for final part of medieval age and difficult for starting part.