Metal Detector Laws

[Molinari]

Greetings fellow Forvmites!

   I just bought a metal detector the other day (Tesoro "Cibola") and I have some questions concerning the laws that govern its use in countries like Italy, Greece, etc.   Originally (I live in Bellingham, MA) I purchased the detector to hunt for some Colonial Coppers, Spanish Silver, Revolutionary War relics, etc., and I always thought it was illegal to take these machines into certain parts of Europe. 

   Well, the man I bought the detector from- actually a very well know U.S. Wholesaler- looked at me as if I had ten heads when I told him "I wish I could bring this to Italy and search for ancient coins".  The dealer said that would be perfectly fine, despite the fact I told him I know- or thought I knew- for sure that these items were not even allowed in the country....

    He said that's nonsense and that he's sold 3 high quality detectors to customers in Italy that month alone (although he wasn't sure if they were licensed users or not, etc.).  He also said that if you're a tourist on the beach using a detector no one would stop you, and that he had a trip planned for this summer.
   
  So, is it or is it not illegal for me to bring my detector to Italy (or Greece) and start digging up some ancients?  My family still owns some land in Italy, would it be legal for me to dig on my own property?  I know the answer is "no", but the seller's comments force me to ask and be sure.  Please say "it's legal",  because I'll be on a plane tomorrow! 

Molinari

[Corduba]

Well, i don´t know anything about italian or greece laws, but in Spain is illegal look for ancients coins. So the machine is not illegal but you can´t use it to look for ancient coins.

If you can read spanish, here is a good link about the spanish laws.

http://www.detectomania.com/legislacion/index.html

Best regards, Ignacio.

[Scipio Helveticus]

Molinari,

The following link is a short guide to where you can and cant detect in Europe.

http://www.ncmd.co.uk/law.htm

With reference to Italy:

The 1939 Act of the custody of artistic and historic objects affords protection to all objects and coins of historical or archaeological value including coins. All objects are State property and must be reported to the Superintendency of Arts. Rewards may be offered up to 1/4 of the value.

Metal detecting is forbidden in the following areas:

Val D'AOSTA

TOSCANA

LAZIO

CALABRIA

SICILIA

Coins found minted after 1500 can be kept by the finder and 10% of their value has to be paid to the landowner.

With reference to where I live:

MALTA

The 1925 - 1974 Antiquities Protection Act affords protection to all objects, both movable and immovable, which are more than 50 years old. Excavation can only be carried out with government authorisation (Article 1). The reporting of accidental finds is compulsory (Article 10).

Since 1979 there has been a ban on the import of any metal detectors of sufficient sensitivity to be of any danger to archaeological sites

I have a Minelab. But I only brought it in as a souvenier, still in its box, and took it right past the coustoms officer at the airport when I arrived from the UK. He didnt even blink! Now supposing along my travels a nice Domitian As happens to leap into the palm of my hand, it will be my pleasure to hand it over to the authorities........in time!

[Molinari]

Thanks Scipio, that link and information are very helpful!

Molinari

[silvernut]

Well, i don´t know anything about italian or greece laws, but in Spain is illegal look for ancients coins. So the machine is not illegal but you can´t use it to look for ancient coins.

Well, as my namesake Ignacio says, it's not illegal in Spain to actually use a detector "per se", but under Spanish law, to dig even a couple of centimeters with your fingers to look for a coin detected is considered an archaeological excavation, and as such, needs all sorts of official permits. And, in any case, the coin, even if you found it in your property, belongs to the Spanish state and will be administered by a museum or other such institution (all this also applies if it's not on land; refer to the recent discovery of thousands of coins under water in an allegedly Spanish vessel...). Finally, what is certainly illegal is to take the coin out of the country...

All this is what's preventing me from getting a detector and go like crazy all over Spain!! I've had dreams where I found a fabulous hoard of silver denarii! But I guess that'll never happen...

Regards,
Ignasi

[Molinari]

But do they actually patrol these places?  If you're seen with a metal detector, would someone stop you and ask to see such permits, etc.?  What if one just lies and says something along the lines of "I was picnicing here the other day and my wife lost a very expensive ring", etc.?  I know for a fact that if I were in any of these countries, NOTHING would stop me from digging, since I'm very good at telling lies and playing dumb (or maybe I just am dumb? )

Molinari

[Bacchus]

I know for a fact that if I were in any of these countries, NOTHING would stop me from digging, since I'm very good at telling lies and playing dumb (or maybe I just am dumb? )

Molinari

Unfortuately it is this sort of attitude that give metal detectorists a bad name and why the practice is generally viewed with great suspicion by both the authorities and landowners alike.  The UK has a quite liberal attitude to responsible detectorists  but there are still 'nighthawks' - those who trespass and hunt of peoples land without permission - who are prosecuted (and rightly so) and therby tarnish the reputation of the vast majority.

As a landowner with a couple of 'interesting ruins' (not Roman) present, I have caught a couple of chancers who thought to a) leave gates open, b) knock down walls, c) dig up holes and leave them open where animals could break their legs.  They now have police records!!

Malcolm

[scardan123]

I live in Italy and don't think using a metal detector is illegal (I am not a lawyer, but I am pretty sure you can UNLESS you do it on an archeological site, I mean: if you have some fields you can use it there, but if you go to a site you'll be in trouble).
However, let's say you own a field, you metal-detect it. OK. You spot something, you start digging... well... uhm... I'd cover the MD in a bag before stating to dig, because even if the field is yours you cannot dig for antique items unless you are authorized, an archeologist working for a research project with the local museum  etc.
So let's say the MD is sealed now in a bag and you are digging in your field. You might just be wanting to plant a tree, no one will ever ask you anything, not even the most paranoid of your neighbors. OK
Let's say you find some roman coins, pretty likely in many parts. But even if you found them in your field, they are NOT yours, they belong to the Italian State (which indeed would throw them soewhere in a storehouse, unless you find something realy exceptional). Anyway you would not be allowed to take them home, it would be an illegal export of archeological "treasures" belonging to the state.  Well, if you find a roman bronze I don't think a policeman will materialize on the spot and take it away, but the law says you cannot put that coin in your bag.
Although I really doubt anyone would ever open your bag in the airport and strip you naked to check for coins, and be able to separate fakes from original if you throw them all in the same box, and even care if those coins are not precious... They will check for terrostist, not for hobby-diggers. But just be warned that it is not legal, so it's up to you.

[jonkag7]

This is a very interesting thread, and I have a question of my own. Does anybody know what the laws are for this type of stuff in Israel? I will be there over the summer, and while I might not have a metal detector, I might just happen to be digging (every place I possibly can, even without any clue if theres anything there ). Any laws against/if I happen to find anything?

Thanks,
Jonathan

[Molinari]

I know for a fact that if I were in any of these countries, NOTHING would stop me from digging, since I'm very good at telling lies and playing dumb (or maybe I just am dumb? )

Molinari

Unfortuately it is this sort of attitude that give metal detectorists a bad name and why the practice is generally viewed with great suspicion by both the authorities and landowners alike.  The UK has a quite liberal attitude to responsible detectorists  but there are still 'nighthawks' - those who trespass and hunt of peoples land without permission - who are prosecuted (and rightly so) and therby tarnish the reputation of the vast majority.

As a landowner with a couple of 'interesting ruins' (not Roman) present, I have caught a couple of chancers who thought to a) leave gates open, b) knock down walls, c) dig up holes and leave them open where animals could break their legs. They now have police records!!

Malcolm

Easy there....I didn't mean to imply that I would run crazy digging up every site that had potential or destroyng anyone's property, but just that I would dig for coins on my own property.  Also, and I though the smiley face with his tongue sticking out indicated this- I was joking when I said NOTHING would stop me.  

As you can see from the original post, my first question was about the laws (hence I'm cautious and don't want to break any laws).   But if the Italian State is going to have such ridiculous bans then yes, I will lie my face off if they are going to question what I do on MY property.

Molinari

[Molinari]

This is a very interesting thread, and I have a question of my own. Does anybody know what the laws are for this type of stuff in Israel? I will be there over the summer, and while I might not have a metal detector, I might just happen to be digging (every place I possibly can, even without any clue if theres anything there ). Any laws against/if I happen to find anything?

Thanks,
Jonathan

Not sure about the laws, but look out for land mines!

Molinari

[silvernut]

But do they actually patrol these places?  If you're seen with a metal detector, would someone stop you and ask to see such permits, etc.? 

In Spain, the Guardia Civil (literally Civil Guard, but more like a rural police force) will and does patrol the fields (obviously within their possibilities), and keep catching "nighthawks" quite often. You can say what you want, but you usually don't buy a metal detector just to find a ring your wife lost...

The other day I was in a small town near Madrid and the locals said someone had recently ransacked a local ruin, medieval remains of a tiny church (they abound in Spain) and had dug out piles and piles of human bones, which they had very neatly piled against a wall, as in a horror docuemntary of some 20th century dictatorship... Of course, they were looking for (and took) rings, bracelets and other precious metals people are buried with.

So yes, the police WILL stop and question you if they find you with a detector in Spain...

Regards,
Ignasi

[Bacchus]

I understand that you are not going to personally start large scale excavations or strip mining large swathes of Europe (no offence intended ) but I was commenting generally after having first hand bad experiances with irresponsible detectorists.  I am actually in favour of them overall as long as they are responsible and follow the due processes required of them.  Modern farming methods introduce chemicals into the soil which unfortunately eat away at any stray metal object contained there so I do think that detectorists do a good 'hovering' job of these stray finds etc.  Again it is the irresponsible nature of a minority that tarnish it for the whole hobby (as in alot of areas in life).

I live in Northern Ireland where the law is not the same as mainland England and the use of metal detectors is covered by the Historic Monuments Act (NI) 1971 which states:

Part IV Section 11: A person shall not, save under and in accordance with a licence .....dig or excavate in or under any land ..... for the purpose of searching generally for archaeological objects

which basicially states "don't do it".


A few miles away across the border in the Republic things are really tight where if you are caught with a metal detector near a historic momument you WILL go to prison (yes, it is that serious) even if you don't detect with it just possessing one in one of these areas is enough.

regards

Malcolm

[Scipio Helveticus]

This is a very interesting thread, and I have a question of my own. Does anybody know what the laws are for this type of stuff in Israel?

From the link I posted, very birefly summarising Israeli laws:

ISRAEL

The Antiquities Act 1978, Section 9a states that `no person shall excavate in a private property for the purpose of discovering antiquities, nor search for antiquities in any other manner, including the use of metal detectors, nor gather antiquities unless he has received a licence for such from the Director. Breach of this section carries a liability to imprisonment for a term of 3 years or a fine of 3,150,000 Shekels.

Section 38 of the same Act states that `any person found on an antiquity site, in whose possession or in whose immediate vicinity are found excavation tools and it can be assumed that they were recently used in excavation work at the site, or in whose possession or in whose immediate vicinity is found a metal detector, is presumed to have intended to discover antiquities unless he proves that he has no such intention.

I will follow this up with the fact that in 2003 an Isreali citizen was arrested in while in possession of a metal detector and excavation implements and JAILED.

[Molinari]

Hmmm, such disappointing news.  Well then, what do you all make of what the metal detector dealer told me (see the first post)?  Was he just full-of-it and trying to sell a detector? (I'd say no because I told him I was ready to buy right when I got there)  Is it possible for tourists to use them on the beaches of Italy, Greece, or even Spain?

Molinari

[Mediolanum]

hello,

unfortunatelly in Italy a new proposal of law of a week ago tell that  the possession of a metaldetector is forbidden and if policeman find you when you dig , you could be go to the prison for 4 years.

this law probably will be approved in the next 3-4 weeks.

ciao

[jonkag7]

Thanks for that information, I guess I won't be excavating in Israel any time soon. Although if I do happen to just glimpse something in the dirt.....well....

Thanks,
Jonathan


From the link I posted, very birefly summarising Israeli laws:

ISRAEL

The Antiquities Act 1978, Section 9a states that `no person shall excavate in a private property for the purpose of discovering antiquities, nor search for antiquities in any other manner, including the use of metal detectors, nor gather antiquities unless he has received a licence for such from the Director. Breach of this section carries a liability to imprisonment for a term of 3 years or a fine of 3,150,000 Shekels.

Section 38 of the same Act states that `any person found on an antiquity site, in whose possession or in whose immediate vicinity are found excavation tools and it can be assumed that they were recently used in excavation work at the site, or in whose possession or in whose immediate vicinity is found a metal detector, is presumed to have intended to discover antiquities unless he proves that he has no such intention.

I will follow this up with the fact that in 2003 an Isreali citizen was arrested in while in possession of a metal detector and excavation implements and JAILED.

[Scipio Helveticus]

Thanks for that information, I guess I won't be excavating in Israel any time soon. Although if I do happen to just glimpse something in the dirt.....well....

Well, there is a get out clause. All you have to is prove you're not looking for anything ancient. If the police stop you, just say that your wife has lost her wedding ring, and be prepared to produce the distressed spouse upon demand!

But dont give up on detecting. Most eastern european states are still detector friendly. I know Estonia and Russia are for sure.

[Xerofall]

Wow, I had no idea other countries had such laws. It makes sense though. Quite a lot of valuable and important historical finds have been plundered by the black market, private collectors and museums in other countries. That's too bad.

Here in the United States, you can dig on your own land, private property with permission and even on some government land (BLM land within reason.) On national parks, it's not allowed. You can casually dig for fossils, minerals or whatever as long as it's not a professional excavation. In Utah keeping or selling dinosaur fossils is illegal, but in other states I think it's okay on private property. (Of course, I'm no expert on the exact details of the law, I could be wrong.)

The only thing of value here in Utah is mineral, paleontological and a little archeological from Native Americans, and that stuff is protected by treaties and such. I'm sure there'd be stuff from the pioneers, but that's not nearly old enough or valuable for me. 

I know you can scour the beaches or Florida in the US after major storms to find old shipwrecked valuables. That's always been a dream vacation for me.

[awl]

I really wish I could find the article, but a few months back in National Geographic there was an article about people literally blasting hillsides up in order to find ancient treasure.

EDIT: Found it- http://www7.nationalgeographic.com/ngm/0612/feature4/index.html

[basemetal]

Do remember it's not always the getting in, the detecting, and  the finding.  It's the getting out.
Very likely depending on where your finds are is the factor in the "interest" you will receive as you leave the country.  Are you taking your metal detector out with you?  Are the coins just in your pocket (I know but I've heard of it from a friend in eastern europe). Did you put them in a jar of say just to suppose, olive oil?  Likely you will be fine-BUT-if you pique the interest of the inspectors at the airport, all kinds of unpleasant things can happen depending on the country. They likely view common LRBs in the same light as they would view a denarius or 12, or a fibula, or whatever.   All kinds of things can happen then.  Your passport may or may not be found to be in order, or many other things.
Bruce

[Scipio Helveticus]

Well, if you are breaking the law, prepare to suffer the consequenses.

[scardan123]

however, although a severe law protecting ancient artifact makes a lot of sense, consider the absurdity of some consequences. Like for instance many museums which are permanently closed because they have no money, and their warehouses/cellars are full with artifacts which -although not top quality- would make every collector's dream.
I remeber once being allowed to visit the cellars of a small museum where I live, and the former director opening a chest -yes a chest big enough to hold a person inside of it!- and it was FULL with roman cameos. They just exhibited the nicest, and left the others there in the chest, in a cellar, underground. Just to give you an idea, bronze coins where measured in kilos, not in numbers, like "we have some kilo bronze coins there".
I consider it a shame, I think that artifacts wich are not very precious and rare (amphors, stone urns, common bronze coins) should be sold to private collectors to raise money in order to better found the museums and the precious pieces.
Near where I live, if you have a field you are not allowed to seed it mechanically, because you would destroy the underlying roman port. But they do not bring it to light, because they have no money to do it (i.e. to buy the fields from the private citizens and start an excavation). So people plant their peas knowing that a few feet underneath there might well be a mosaic or a burial site. Really a crazy, crazy situation.

[PLINIUS]

In Italy it is legal to own a metal detector, it is forbidden to use it in archeological sites , in the case of a find, everithing it is of property of the Italian State. Laws in Italy are sometimes disattended, but when they are applied, it is a terrible thing to be involved, for a thing like this there are years of prison. For people like me, I live in Italy, and that collects ancients, it is a must to buy only by official dealers with invoice, as I have to demonstrate the legal provenience of my coins. 

[Cibalia]

But do they actually patrol these places?  If you're seen with a metal detector, would someone stop you and ask to see such permits, etc.?  What if one just lies and says something along the lines of "I was picnicing here the other day and my wife lost a very expensive ring", etc.?  I know for a fact that if I were in any of these countries, NOTHING would stop me from digging, since I'm very good at telling lies and playing dumb (or maybe I just am dumb? )

Molinari

I'd stop you if I saw you. Two Austrians were chased and arrested last year for detecting on an ancient site. It made the 7 o'clock news. So it is taken seriously here in Croatia. But there is no law against metal detecting. Few countries actually have laws against metal detecting. What they have are laws against searching for archaeological artefacts, or digging them up. That is why I only work on ploughed land, well away from protected sites.
Changes in the law or introduction of new laws come from the abuse of metal detectors by theives on protected sites.