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Author Topic: famous ancient coin collectors  (Read 16567 times)

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gavignano

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famous ancient coin collectors
« on: November 22, 2006, 10:31:46 pm »
Thought this would be an interesting thread:
Can you name some  people throughout history who were famous, and also collected ancients, especially Roman ancients? You can post from ancient men to 21st century actors...etc.
Also, I recall my dad saying many years ago what a wonderful collection of ancients King Farouk had, but he overcleaned them? True?   Joe

Offline the_Apostate

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Re: famous ancient coin collectors
« Reply #1 on: November 23, 2006, 05:37:08 am »
Petrarch (I think?), Caruso and the world-famous Swedish poet Carl Snoilsky and yes of course queen Christina.

During the rennaissance there must have been many filthy rich and famous people that collected ancients. A Nero sestertius was more expensive than a Titian and a Titian was quite expensive even then. Today even a bunch of perfect Nero sestertii would be quite cheap compared to a Titian.

Offline Blindado

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Re: famous ancient coin collectors
« Reply #2 on: November 23, 2006, 06:41:35 am »
Cheaper, yes, but far easier to store.

Retrospectator

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Re: famous ancient coin collectors
« Reply #3 on: November 23, 2006, 07:11:57 am »
Quote
A Nero sestertius was more expensive than a Titian and a Titian was quite expensive even then. Today even a bunch of perfect Nero sestertii would be quite cheap compared to a Titian.

Renaissance artists could use portraits and images on ancient coins for their paintings. Titian himself painted a portrait of a numismatist / antiquarian of his own time (Jacopo Strada). Perhaps Titian approached him for coins for his work. Titian's portrait of Jacopo Strada can be seen at this web-site:

http://www.khm.at/system2E.html?/staticE/page239.html

Offline dougsmit

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Re: famous ancient coin collectors
« Reply #4 on: November 27, 2006, 07:29:12 pm »
A highlight to me is US President John Quincy Adams.  The reason he stands out is that his collection was sold at auction in 1971 (Stacks) and it is quite possible to own a coin from the collection (I have two).  The catalog was only partially illustrated and many coins were in multiple lots so positive ID can be an issue even if you have the ticket that came with the coins.  Many of the coins were a bit ordinary and many have probably been separated from their documents so you will never know if you have one or not. 

Anyone else have one?

gavignano

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Re: famous ancient coin collectors
« Reply #5 on: November 30, 2006, 10:36:31 pm »
I have found:
Buddy Ebsen  - mentioned very frequently.

But also, Nicole Kidman collecting ancient Judean pieces???? - anyone want to add to this? Joe

Offline Jerome Holderman

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Re: famous ancient coin collectors
« Reply #6 on: December 05, 2006, 06:36:58 am »
A highlight to me is US President John Quincy Adams.  The reason he stands out is that his collection was sold at auction in 1971 (Stacks) and it is quite possible to own a coin from the collection (I have two).  The catalog was only partially illustrated and many coins were in multiple lots so positive ID can be an issue even if you have the ticket that came with the coins.  Many of the coins were a bit ordinary and many have probably been separated from their documents so you will never know if you have one or not. 

Anyone else have one?
I tried to bid on a couple once but lost  :(. Would still like to own one, even if outside my collection focus.

Offline awl

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Re: famous ancient coin collectors
« Reply #7 on: January 22, 2007, 08:26:20 pm »
A highlight to me is US President John Quincy Adams.  The reason he stands out is that his collection was sold at auction in 1971 (Stacks) and it is quite possible to own a coin from the collection (I have two).  The catalog was only partially illustrated and many coins were in multiple lots so positive ID can be an issue even if you have the ticket that came with the coins.  Many of the coins were a bit ordinary and many have probably been separated from their documents so you will never know if you have one or not. 

Anyone else have one?

I just purchased one. It is a denarius of geta with victory on the reverse.

http://www.erols.com/oldtowncoin/getajqa.JPG

Does anyone know how many coins were in his collection?

Offline Cleisthenes

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Re: famous ancient coin collectors
« Reply #8 on: January 23, 2007, 05:35:20 am »
I have read the Teddy Roosevlet kept an Athenian Tet in his pocket.  That coin inspired him to have U.S. coins redesigned (http://72.14.235.104/search?q=cache:qJChetISTqoJ:rg.ancients.info/owls/+teddy+roosevelt+athenian+coin&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1).

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Offline gallienus1

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Re: famous ancient coin collectors
« Reply #9 on: February 03, 2007, 08:36:27 am »
Many years ago I bought a quinarius from the John Quincy Adams collection. It is not in great condition but I have a real soft spot for it.

Steve

Offline mauseus

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Re: famous ancient coin collectors
« Reply #10 on: February 03, 2007, 02:52:22 pm »
Hi,

For the British contingent - G R "Bob" Arnold (who played the character Tom Forrest in the radio series The Archers) collected Roman coins since childhood. His collection of Severan silver coins sold in the 1980's. I don't have a coin from the sale but I have the catalogue.

Regards,

Mauseus

Offline moonmoth

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Re: famous ancient coin collectors
« Reply #11 on: February 03, 2007, 04:35:13 pm »
As it happens, I too have a copy of that catalogue of the sale of Arnold's collection of Severan silver at Glendining & Co, London, on 21 November 1984.   There are 322 plates and some enlargements, including some of the rarer types, including a nice photo of one denarius illustrating the stone of Emesa in detail.  Unfortunately, I don't have any of the coins either, but I wish you could still get them at those estimates!  (That particular rarity was estimated at GBP 2,000 and I would be a long way from affording that price even today.)

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Offline Jochen

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Re: famous ancient coin collectors
« Reply #12 on: February 03, 2007, 05:32:56 pm »
One of the most famous coin collectors was the great tenor Enrico Caruso. Not ancient but famous. Go to Coinarchives and enter 'Caruso'. I think your eyes will begin to glow!

Here is the link http://www.coinarchives.com/a/results.php?results=100&search=caruso

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Offline curtislclay

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Re: famous ancient coin collectors
« Reply #13 on: February 03, 2007, 05:41:08 pm »
It doesn't particularly interest me to own a coin just because it was formerly owned by a famous person, say Jackie Kennedy or John Quincy Adams.

I'd rather own a coin from a collection that was famous on its own merits, for the quality and completeness of its coverage, whatever the occupation of the collector and his fame or lack of it for other achievements!

I would like to have a coin from King Farouk's or Queen Christina's collections, not because they were royalty, but because they formed superb and famous coin collections, which are known to us through sale catalogues and other publications.  I treasure coins from the famous Trau Collection just as much, even though its creators were mere wealthy tea merchants in Vienna in the later 19th and early 20th centuries.

Bob Arnold I consider a worthy pedigree, not because he was a radio personality, but because he formed a very distinguished collection of Severan silver coins.  I do have some of his coins, or rather did until I passed them on to the BM or the Ashmolean, having participated in both the auction of his pre-Severan silver in 1969 and that of his Severan collection in 1984.  

I also have plaster casts of most of the rarities in his collection, made when he invited me to view it at his home in Burford when I was studying in Oxford in the early 1970s, and also during the viewing in London for the 1984 sale.  I wasn't able to buy the Stone of Emesa coin either, but at least I have a plaster cast of it!
Curtis Clay

Offline awl

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Re: famous ancient coin collectors
« Reply #14 on: February 03, 2007, 06:18:00 pm »
It doesn't particularly interest me to own a mediocre coin just because it was formerly owned by a famous person, say Jackie Kennedy or John Quincy Adams.

I'd rather own a coin from a collection that was famous on its own merits, for the quality and completeness of its coverage, whatever the occupation of the collector and his fame or lack of it for other achievements!

I would like to have a coin from King Farouk's or Queen Christina's collections, not because they were royalty, but because they formed superb and famous coin collections, which are known to us through sale catalogues and other publications.  I treasure coins from the famous Trau Collection just as much, even though its creators were mere wealthy tea merchants in Vienna in the later 19th and early 20th centuries.

Bob Arnold I consider a worthy pedigree, not because he was a radio personality, but because he formed a very distinguished collection of Severan silver coins.  I do have some of his coins, having participated in both the auction of his pre-Severan silver in 1969 and that of his Severan collection in 1984. 

I also have plaster casts of most of the rarities in his collection, made when he invited me to view it in Burford when I was studying in Oxford in the early 1970s, and also during the viewing for the 1984 sale.  I wasn't able to buy the Stone of Emesa coin either, but at least I have a plaster cast of it!

I enjoy having my John Adams' Geta for 2 reasons. One is because I think it is part of Roman history and American history. Just thinking that he and a Roman held that coin makes my day. And secondly because it was a Geta in my budget and I collect coins of Geta.

Offline Schwami

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Re: famous ancient coin collectors
« Reply #15 on: February 04, 2007, 11:53:44 am »
Some other famous collectors:

Jascha Heifitz (violinist)
J. P. Morgan (financier)

Bob Arnold also had a collection of pre-Severan denarii that he sold through Glendining in 1969, many of which are now the plate coins used in Roman Silver Coins.  I was fortunate several years ago to obtain a Trajan denarius from that collection.
Lyndall J. Huggler

Offline adson

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Re: famous ancient coin collectors
« Reply #16 on: April 05, 2007, 10:48:48 am »
I can add one more:

Johann Wolfgang Goethe was a collector of ancient romans. I do not know more about his collections (numbers, specialization, etc.) and what happened to it after his death, but if you visit his house in Weimar, you can see the drawers, in which he stored the coins. Similar to the Renaissance in Goethes time, especially in the second part of his life, Greek and Roman classical antiquity was very popular (the period is called "Weimarer Klassik" in german).

adson

Offline Jochen

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Re: famous ancient coin collectors
« Reply #17 on: April 05, 2007, 06:17:12 pm »
Teddy Kollek, the famous Lordmayor of Jerusalem, deceased 2. January 2007, was a known collector.

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Offline Tiathena

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Re: famous ancient coin collectors
« Reply #18 on: April 05, 2007, 09:57:29 pm »
     
     I had missed this thread.
  I have to say I’d be much the same as Awl in such case, and would love to own an ancient Roman coin which had once been in John. Q. Adams’ possession.
  It would be, for me at least, impossible to hold such in hand and not try wrap my mind around the enormity, relative ‘continuum’ and dialectic of the dualistic-ideologies of Republicanism and Imperialism (not to mention its being a particularly poignant reflection with regard to the US specifically, today).
  Not that I’ve need of any coin to do so, but just to press such symbolic-token of that profundity in my palm would be immensely delightful.
 
   Even over & beyond that – J. Q. Adams remains in my heart & thought, quite probably the Greatest man to ever hold public office in the United States – and he was in any event, a truly great & admirable human being.
  I can only dream of the pleasures I’d receive in having a fine Antoninus Pius which had once belonged to John Adams, of which denomination, rarity nor state of preservation would matter a jot.
 
  Best,
  Tia
   
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Offline Ardatirion

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Re: famous ancient coin collectors
« Reply #19 on: April 05, 2007, 10:06:40 pm »
There were really ancient coin collectors. I read a report of a hoard found in Britain consisting mostly of gold and silver issues. The interesting thing though, each coin was of a different reverse or obverse type!

Offline curtislclay

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Re: famous ancient coin collectors
« Reply #20 on: April 05, 2007, 10:21:23 pm »
We know there were ancient coin collectors because Pliny says some people would pay higher prices for plated counterfeits of coins than for the corresponding official issues in solid silver.

I'd like to see the report of that hoard, however, since I am unaware of the discovery of any hoard which was clearly an ancient coin collection.  Smaller hoards containing many different types are quite normal, since there was great variety in many ancient coinages and coins often remained in circulation for a century or more.
Curtis Clay

Offline Ardatirion

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Re: famous ancient coin collectors
« Reply #21 on: April 06, 2007, 12:13:02 am »
I'll see if i can find it again, but i doubt it.

Offline Ardatirion

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Re: famous ancient coin collectors
« Reply #22 on: April 29, 2007, 03:31:57 pm »
So, I finally found which book I got that hoard reference from. It was an article in the October 1988 issue of the journal World Archaeology, Volume 20 number 2, pages 270-284. The article was written by N. B. Aitchison and is called "Roman wealth, native ritual: coin hoards within and beyond Roman Britain".

If you have Jstor access, you can read it here

http://www.jstor.org/view/00438243/ap000060/00a00080/0?currentResult=00438243%2bap000060%2b00a00080%2b0%2c00&searchUrl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.jstor.org%2Fsearch%2FBasicResults%3Fhp%3D25%26si%3D1%26gw%3Djtx%26jtxsi%3D1%26jcpsi%3D1%26artsi%3D1%26Query%3Daa%253A%2522N.%2BB.%2BAitchison%2522%26wc%3Don

If you don't have jstor access and can't find the journal, PM me and we can work something out.

WilliamKellogg

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Re: famous ancient coin collectors
« Reply #23 on: June 03, 2007, 11:50:32 pm »
     Aside from Buddy Ebsen, there are many other famous coin collectors, some of them mentioned here, including: Wayne Gretzky, Nicholas Cage, Many in the Dupont family, J.P. Morgan,  Enrico Caruso, Nicole kidman, Chris Aable, Robert Wagner, Jack Black and Tony Blair.
     I was fortunate to run into both Buddy Ebsen and Chris Aable at the Long Beach Coin Show in the late 1980s.  I was heading down one of the walkways and overheard who I first thought were two grandparents and their grandson discussing a meeting for a coin club.
     I was interested in joining a coin club but was reluctant to interrupt them.  However, they paused for a moment and glanced my way so I introduced myself and stated that I've been wanting to join a coin club. 
     The elderly gentleman introduced himself as Buddy and introduced me to his wife Dorothy and the boy, Chris.  The "boy" turned out to be a young man, Chris AAble, a fellow TV/Film actor as well.  We got into a discussion about Seated Liberty Coins and Lincoln Cents.  A crowd of dealers began to gather around us, and the three of them said they would have to be leaving soon.  I think they wanted more privacy.
   I asked Mr. Ebsen if he could autograph my Coin Show Directory, and he put his hand on the shoulder of the Mr. Aable and said something to the effect that "I'm not working any more and that I ought to have Chris Aable's autograph because he is hosting the  Hollywood Today TV Show and is on General Hospital and some other shows", I forgot everything he said.
   Long story, short, they both were kidding around and were kind enough to autograph my directory They also invited me to be a member of the Beverly Hills Coin Club. 
  Back in the late 80s I met with about a dozen or so other members in Century City twice per year.  Back then, membership was invitation-only and they weren't fond of inviting dealers.  Buddy stated that most dealers go to clubs only to sell coins or make sales contacts. 
     But now with the advent of the internet, the Beverly Hills Coin Club has members in all 50 states and over a hundred countries.   
  Oh, I think Buddy was in his eighties when I met him, but even then, he was a tall guy, well over six feet.  His beautiful wife, Dorothy Knott, who I assume was also in her seventies back then, was very nice and gracious.  She reminded me of Nancy Reagan in terms of her appearance and demeanor.
  I miss them all, but occasionally see the still-young Chris Aable at the Long Beach Coin Show, building a set of ancient Greek coins and a set of Bust Silver Dollars by variety.  He told me he expects prices to keep increasing and he will sell it in a few years and donate the money to www.kiva.org   When I first got online around 1995, he sent me the following email, which I have saved under my favorites:
"We're all far from perfect and we all have our own faults and failures.  Hopefully, most of us learn and grow from them.  In the end, its not what we own that matters the most, it's also who we are and what type of person we've been.  Rare coins can often be a good means to an even better end, from the moment when we begin collecting."
- Chris Aable 
     Quite a guy.  Both the profits and fun we get from rare coins can often be a good means to an even better end.

Offline Schwami

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Re: famous ancient coin collectors
« Reply #24 on: June 06, 2007, 05:22:25 pm »
Several years ago a coin dealer mentioned to me that he had sold coins of Marcus Aurelius to Bill Clinton.  The Meditations of Marcus Aurelius is known to be a favorite book of his.
Lyndall J. Huggler

 

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