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Author Topic: Septimius Severus, Barbar-Imitatio(?), AR-Denarius, MARTI VICTORI,  (Read 260 times)

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Online quadrans

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Septimius Severus, Barbar-Imitatio(?), AR-Denarius, MARTI VICTORI,

https://www.forumancientcoins.com/gallery/displayimage.php?pid=171127

This Septimius Severus denarius is a Barbar-Imitatio or low-grade Eastern mint???

049 Septimius Severus (193-211 A.D.), RIC IV-I -, Barbar-Imitatio, AR-Denarius, MARTI VICTORI, Mars walking right, #1
avers: ... L SEPT SEV PERT AVG ... (???), Laureate bust right.
reverse: MARTI VICTORI, Mars walking right, holding spear and trophy.
exergue: -/-//--, diameter: 16,5-17,0mm, weight: 1,78g, axis: 6h,
mint: Barbar-Imitatio (???), date: A.D.,
ref: RIC IV-I (???), p-, RSC-, S-, (???)


Regards

 Joe
All the Best :), Joe
https://www.forumancientcoins.com/gallery/index.php?cat=31252

Offline maridvnvm

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Re: Septimius Severus, Barbar-Imitatio(?), AR-Denarius, MARTI VICTORI,
« Reply #1 on: July 11, 2021, 02:14:28 pm »
Certainly not the style of the output of any of the recognised mints so unofficial.

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Re: Septimius Severus, Barbar-Imitatio(?), AR-Denarius, MARTI VICTORI,
« Reply #2 on: July 11, 2021, 02:38:05 pm »
Yes,  :)

Thank you, Martin+++

I tried to look for something similar in your Gallery but couldn't find one...


Regards

 Joe
All the Best :), Joe
https://www.forumancientcoins.com/gallery/index.php?cat=31252

Offline Ron C2

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Re: Septimius Severus, Barbar-Imitatio(?), AR-Denarius, MARTI VICTORI,
« Reply #3 on: July 24, 2021, 09:03:33 am »
Definitely unofficial and possibly barbarous.
My Severan Denarii Gallery: Click here

R. Cormier, Ottawa

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Re: Septimius Severus, Barbar-Imitatio(?), AR-Denarius, MARTI VICTORI,
« Reply #4 on: July 26, 2021, 10:55:25 am »
Yes, Ron,  ;)

Thank you, I have the same opinion  +++

Regards

 Joe
All the Best :), Joe
https://www.forumancientcoins.com/gallery/index.php?cat=31252

Offline Ron C2

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Re: Septimius Severus, Barbar-Imitatio(?), AR-Denarius, MARTI VICTORI,
« Reply #5 on: July 26, 2021, 12:55:42 pm »
Quote from: quadrans on July 26, 2021, 10:55:25 am
Yes, Ron,  ;)

Thank you, I have the same opinion  +++

Regards

 Joe

You likely already know this, but the only RIC reference that matches the coin is RIC IVA 114 so the obverse is likely L SEPT SEV PERT AVG [IMP X].  That said, I think it's an unofficial of barbarous copy of this reference - they likely copied an original with a less-skilled hand.
My Severan Denarii Gallery: Click here

R. Cormier, Ottawa

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Re: Septimius Severus, Barbar-Imitatio(?), AR-Denarius, MARTI VICTORI,
« Reply #6 on: July 26, 2021, 01:04:55 pm »
Yes, Ron,  :) +++

You are right, I know that information because I have the original coin too... ;) +++

I just wanted a confirmation from the board that this coin was too rough, even though both the obverse and reverse could be identified.

So it’s definitely a contemporary probably barbaric imitation.

Anyway, thank you for the helpful words.

Regards

 Joe
All the Best :), Joe
https://www.forumancientcoins.com/gallery/index.php?cat=31252

Offline maridvnvm

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Re: Septimius Severus, Barbar-Imitatio(?), AR-Denarius, MARTI VICTORI,
« Reply #7 on: July 27, 2021, 04:48:08 am »
Many of these barbaric imitations are well executed but not sufficiently well to be in the style of the official output. I have gathered a few nice barbs over the years.

Obv:- IMV (sic) CAE L SEP SEV PERT AVG, Laureate head right
Rev:- LEG II ADIVT / TR P COS, Legionary eagle between two standards
Barbarous imitation of coins minted in Rome. A.D. 193



I have a strong preference for examples that I think are imitating the eastern mints

This one seems to be imitating the later style of Laodicea



This one seems to be imitating "Emesa"

Obv:– IMP CAE L SEP SEV PERT AVG CO, Laureate head right
Rev:– VICT AVG TR P [COS II P P], Victory walking left, holding wreath in right hand, palm in left



as are these which I find interesting because they are an obverse die match with different reverses (bought several years apart)

Obv:– IMP CAE L SEPT ERT AVT COS II, Laureate head right
Rev:– VICTOR SEV-E-R AVG, Victory walking left, holding wreath in right hand, palm in left



Obv:– IMP CAE L SEPT ERT AVT COS II, Laureate head right
Rev:– IOVL SER ?? AVG, Jupiter?, seated left



This one imitating eastern IMP II

Obv:– L SEPT SEV PERT AVG IMP II, laureate head right
Rev:– AEQVIT AVG TR P COS II, Aequitas standing left, holding scales and cornucopia


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Re: Septimius Severus, Barbar-Imitatio(?), AR-Denarius, MARTI VICTORI,
« Reply #8 on: July 27, 2021, 04:58:21 am »
Wow,  ;)

Nice collection+++

Thank you, Martin, to share it... +++

Regards

 Joe
All the Best :), Joe
https://www.forumancientcoins.com/gallery/index.php?cat=31252

Offline Ron C2

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Re: Septimius Severus, Barbar-Imitatio(?), AR-Denarius, MARTI VICTORI,
« Reply #9 on: July 28, 2021, 04:39:07 pm »
This one imitating eastern IMP II

Obv:– L SEPT SEV PERT AVG IMP II, laureate head right
Rev:– AEQVIT AVG TR P COS II, Aequitas standing left, holding scales and cornucopia



Wow, this one is pretty nice for an unofficial copy - almost makes me wonder if it's a mint hybrid/error?  Cos II is a first year of reign obverse (193) and the reverse is a Pertinax type - it's conceivable both dies could be in the same mint at the same time given what was going on at the time.  Pertinax had only been killed a few months before.

RIC IV lists this very coin at the bottom of page 92 as a known hybrid - possibly this is an official/error coin?

Sorry for the hijack quadrans  :-[
My Severan Denarii Gallery: Click here

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Offline maridvnvm

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Re: Septimius Severus, Barbar-Imitatio(?), AR-Denarius, MARTI VICTORI,
« Reply #10 on: July 29, 2021, 04:31:59 am »
I discussed this coin with Curtis Clay back when I bought the coin. The result of this discussion was that the style is too far removed from the official to be consistent with the output of the IMP II mint. As such I have classified it as unofficial until I can find any evidence to the contrary.

Offline Ron C2

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Re: Septimius Severus, Barbar-Imitatio(?), AR-Denarius, MARTI VICTORI,
« Reply #11 on: July 29, 2021, 07:48:19 am »
I discussed this coin with Curtis Clay back when I bought the coin. The result of this discussion was that the style is too far removed from the official to be consistent with the output of the IMP II mint. As such I have classified it as unofficial until I can find any evidence to the contrary.

Far be it for me to question Curtis, but the reverse looks stylistically right to me. On the obverse, the nose is more aquiline than most I see on early septimius Rome work, but not enough that I would have concluded unofficial. But I'm not an authority in the matter, far from it.

I would say I see the greatest stylistic variety of septimius portraits at the Rome mint in the 193-194 era.

I would also say that if this is not official, then the piece quoted in RIC, which unfortunately is not a plate coin, is probably also a copy.
My Severan Denarii Gallery: Click here

R. Cormier, Ottawa

 

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