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Author Topic: Unidentified Republican Janus As - ass on deck  (Read 355 times)

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Offline Connect4

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Unidentified Republican Janus As - ass on deck
« on: October 01, 2022, 12:06:01 pm »
There appears to be two separate animals on the deck. I can’t find a full ID on this.
Obv. Head of bearded Janus; I - mark of value above.
Rev. Prow of galley right. Ass standing left on deck. To its right another reclining Ass facing right. Two broad diagonal lines parallel to prow to the right. A series of pellets on side of galley.
31.0-32.0mm 5hr 31.9gr
Any thoughts?  Thanks

Offline Meepzorp

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Re: Unidentified Republican Janus As - ass on deck
« Reply #1 on: October 01, 2022, 02:42:31 pm »
Hi C4,

I have 3 comments regarding your thoughts:

1) I think the "diagonal lines" at upper right on the reverse are scratches.

2) The "Ass" you are seeing on the left probably isn't an animal. It is probably part of the deck structure.

3) The "Ass" you are seeing on the right probably isn't an ass. Why do you think it is that?

Here is my example of the type you think it is (fourth coin):

https://www.forumancientcoins.com/meepzorp/rr_pt09.htm

Your coin looks nothing like mine.

Meepzorp

Offline PMah

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Re: Unidentified Republican Janus As - ass on deck
« Reply #2 on: October 01, 2022, 08:52:04 pm »
The anonymous As are often very difficult to pin down precisely; I agree with Meepzorp that this is not the Cr 195/1 "Ass" As.   The left-ward angled thing is likely the "corvus" = boarding bridge, or the deckhouse, or both smudged together and often vaguely depicted to begin with.
    There will not be any "pellets" on an As, and I do not see any.  Pellets were features of the smaller factions.
     The weight also likely makes it earlier than the "Ass-As".
     I think there is a trace of "ROMA" below the galley.
 
    There could be something else, but it is a bit hard to say.  My guess is that there aren't any of the specific symbols that make out a distinct issue.

     You might want to take a look at http://andrewmccabe.ancients.info/RRC056.html for a detailed look at these anonymous coins and to get a sense of where your coin fits in.   Perhaps the "G" groups, G4 maybe, but don't expect a definite match as these are often poorly struck and worn, so very ambiguous.  The examples are far sharper than the vast majority of specimens.  The article is a a great resource, worth the time even if you don't come close to a match.
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Offline Meepzorp

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Re: Unidentified Republican Janus As - ass on deck
« Reply #3 on: October 02, 2022, 02:08:12 am »
Hi PMah,

Thanks for providing a great explanation and for providing the link to Andrew's site.

I wonder what that object is to the right of the deckhouse (between the deckhouse and the bow). It may hold the key to definitively attributing this example. It looks something like the head of a hammer.

Meepzorp

Offline Connect4

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Re: Unidentified Republican Janus As - ass on deck
« Reply #4 on: October 02, 2022, 04:17:13 am »
Thanks to both of you for your insightful comments.

I have taken a couple of new pictures.

You were, of course, right the "diagonal lines" are obviously scratches! I was evidently misinterpreting the deck features and seeing an ass.

Andrew's site is very useful. I agree that my coin is very close to the "G" groups especially G4. However, the object is to the right of the deckhouse is very difficult to place.

 

Offline PMah

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Re: Unidentified Republican Janus As - ass on deck
« Reply #5 on: October 04, 2022, 08:59:47 pm »
I may be starting to see things, but also look at Crawford  184 butterfly & vine branch,  which have some similar shapes above the deck.
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Offline Connect4

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Re: Unidentified Republican Janus As - ass on deck
« Reply #6 on: October 05, 2022, 05:06:16 am »
Thanks to you both for your helpful comments.
 
I have attached the best possible image. This shows more detail than in the hand!

I can’t see any evidence for ROMA below. This area and that above the deck structure is worn. Therefore, Crawford 184/1a seems best.

I found many examples of the type on ‘Coinage of the Roman Republic Online’ http://numismatics.org/crro/  Unfortunately, no exact matches.  I see other die variations around the rostrum area

 

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