Numismatic and History Discussion Forums > Greek Coins Discussion Forum
MFB Man Faced Bull types
Andrew McCabe:
Nick
It would be very helpful if you would ask for one or other of the main MFB threads to be stickied, and even that several of the threads be combined. This is about the 10th time I've come to the subject of MFBs and wondered which thread I should attach a response to, and why anyway was there a scattershot of threads rather than a continuing Stickie that would ensure the lesser discussions were not lost.
That grumpiness out of the way, I have some new information from you, an extract from an history book, that discusses MFBs. Michael P. Fronda, Between Rome and Carthage: Southern Italy during the Second Punic War. Cambridge: Cambridge University Press, 2010. Pp. xxviii, 374. ISBN 9780521516945.
See attachments. First is main text, second are two footnotes that discuss MFBs.
Molinari:
Thanks for pointing out this thread, Andrew, and for providing the excerpts from the book. He gives a really nice overview!
About a stickie, I like the idea but the trouble with doing it is, the many MFB threads, while all bound by the iconography, seem appropriate for specific boards:
1. There's my personal MFB gallery thread
https://www.forumancientcoins.com/board/index.php?topic=92932.0
2. The website update thread
https://www.forumancientcoins.com/board/index.php?topic=80983.msg606005#new
3. Many identification threads (e.g. is this an MFB? I can think of Pantikapaion, Athens, and Methymna right off the bat)
https://www.forumancientcoins.com/board/index.php?topic=97896.0 (Methymna)
https://www.forumancientcoins.com/board/index.php?topic=93629.0 ("Athens")
4. A few language translation threads (there's an Eckhel thread and a C. Weiss thread, plus a few others)
Alfoldi:
https://www.forumancientcoins.com/board/index.php?topic=99980.msg618527#msg618527
5. The general "River Gods" thread already on the Classical Numismatics board.
https://www.forumancientcoins.com/board/index.php?topic=46877.0
6. Very specific MFB coin threads, like the "Romaion" MFB thread you participated in awhile back.
https://www.forumancientcoins.com/board/index.php?topic=95156.0
7. Other ID and forgery threads submitted from other members. plus my own Panormos "tooled" thread
https://www.forumancientcoins.com/board/index.php?topic=96180.0
Sileraioi fakes:
https://www.forumancientcoins.com/board/index.php?topic=100141.0
https://www.forumancientcoins.com/board/index.php?topic=99282.0
8. Other related threads, like Panortmos/Sys, Distribution Map, etc.
https://www.forumancientcoins.com/board/index.php?topic=95083.0 (Panormos)
https://www.forumancientcoins.com/board/index.php?topic=88972.0 (Distribution Map)
And my websites:
Bronze: https://manfacedbulls.wordpress.com/
Silver: https://manfacedbullsar.wordpress.com/
Gold: https://manfacedbullsau.wordpress.com/
Perhaps we actually need an MFB board! (just kidding) Or, perhaps I can insert links to this reply (when I get a chance) and we can sticky this thread?
Andrew McCabe:
I think it's worth citing Fronda in your intended MFB book, because he is the premier historian of the second Punic war today, and therefore his insights into what coin type commonality mean for historic alliances etc. will resonate more than if the observations were made by a non-historian numismatist. He is pointing out especially close alliances that happen to mirror in especially close coin types. The same point he makes regarding Campania might have wider applicability.
Stickie: It might be worthwhile asking a moderator to sticky the Maps discussion (probably the most enduring) and combining it with the website update threads (they can all be merged in date order), and with any other threads that address MFBs as their sole subject e.g. ROMAION, but not River Gods. Then add on your reply above, and use that as the foundation thread where people can dump further MFB observations as they wish. All this is presuming that a gentle moderator would agree to (a) Stickie (b) merging some threads you point to. There's a comparable long running Stickie on legionary denarii that is probably much less important than this subject, so I'm hopeful.
Molinari:
--- Quote from: Andrew McCabe on October 21, 2014, 08:59:32 am ---I think it's worth citing Fronda in your intended MFB book, because he is the premier historian of the second Punic war today, and therefore his insights into what coin type commonality mean for historic alliances etc. will resonate more than if the observations were made by a non-historian numismatist. He is pointing out especially close alliances that happen to mirror in especially close coin types. The same point he makes regarding Campania might have wider applicability.
Stickie: It might be worthwhile asking a moderator to sticky the Maps discussion (probably the most enduring) and combining it with the website update threads (they can all be merged in date order), and with any other threads that address MFBs as their sole subject e.g. ROMAION, but not River Gods. Then add on your reply above, and use that as the foundation thread where people can dump further MFB observations as they wish. All this is presuming that a gentle moderator would agree to (a) Stickie (b) merging some threads you point to. There's a comparable long running Stickie on legionary denarii that is probably much less important than this subject, so I'm hopeful.
--- End quote ---
Thanks, Andrew. The common coin types are interesting but we also have cases of rivals employing MFBs contemporaneously, like Ambrakia and Akarnania. Although, the history of allegiances in that area from the 5th through 1st century isn't as clear cut as other areas.
Thanks Dino for the stickie.
Molinari:
For those interested, here is a preliminary list of all Sambon bronze man-faced bull coins from Neapolis with corresponding Taliercio numbers. I'll add HN Italy at some point. I didn't add coins minted at Neapolis for other areas.
Sambon-Taliercio
560- Ib, 1
561- Ia, 4/Ib, 2
562- Ia, 3
563- Ib, 3
564- Ib, 5
565
566- Ic, 4
567- Ib, 6
568- t.I-IIb, 1
569
570
571- Ib, 7
572- Ic, 1
573- Ic, 3
574
575
576- Id, 1
577
578- Id, 2
579- Id, 7
580- t.I-IIc, 1
581- IId, 1
582-t.I-IIc, 4
583-IId, 4
584- IId, 6
585- IId,10
586-IId, 2
587-IId, 11
588
589-IId, 15
590-IId, 17
591-IId, 18
592-IId, 20
593-IIc, 1
594-IIc, 3
595
596- IIc, 5
597
598- IIc, 4
599-IIc, 6
600a-IIc, 7
601+/b- IIc, 12/IIc, 11
602
603- IVf, 2
604-IVf, 3
605-IVf, 6
606
607-IVf, 5
608-IVf, 7
609
610
611
612-t.I-IIa, 1
613-IIa, 1
614-IIa, 4
615
616-IIa, 3
617-IIa, 17
618 IIa16
619
620-IIa, 20
621-IIa, 13
622-IIa, 15
623-IIa, 5
624-IIa, 18
625-IIa, 26
626a/b-IIa, 27/IIa, 28
627-IIa, 19
628-IIa, 8
629a-IIa, 7
630-IIa, 9
631-IIa, 10
632-IIa, 11
633-IIa, 29
634/c-IIa, 24/IIa, 25
635-IIa, 30
636-IIa, 32
637-IIa, 40
638-IIa, 38
639-IIa, 31
640-IIa, 37
641
642
643-IIa, 21
644-IIa, 12
645
646-IIa, 34
647-IIa, 33
648-IIa, 35
649-IIa, 23
650-IIa, 6
651-IIIa, 1
652-IIIa, 5
653-IIIa, 4
654-IIIa, 3
655-IIIa, 7
656-IIIa, 6
657-IIIa, 8
658-IIIa, 10
659-IIIa, 11
660-IIIa, 14
661-IIIa, 13
662-IIIa, 12
663-IIIa, 16
664-IIIa, 22
665a/b-IIIa, 24/IIIa, 20
666
667-IIIa, 27
668-IIIa, 29
669-IIIa, 32
670-IIIa, 33
671
672-IIIa, 34
673
674-IIIa, 40
675-IIIa, 37
676-IIIa, 39
677-IIIa, 38
678-IIIa, 43
679
680
681
682
683-IIIa, 45
684-IIIa, 46
685
686-IIIa, 47
687a/b-IIIa, 50/IIIa, 53
688-IIIa, 51
689-IIIa, 55
690-IIIa, 56
691
692
693
694
695
696
697-IVd, 1
698-IIIb, 1
699-IVd, 9
700-IVd, 7
701-IVd, 4
702-IVd, 2
703
704-IVd, 5
705
706
707
Ia, 1
Ia, 2
Ia, 5
Ia, 6
Ib, 4
Ib, 8
Ic, 2
Ic, 5
Id, 2
Id, 4
Id, 5
Id, 6
t.I-IIb, 1
t.I-IIc, 2
t.I-IIc, 3
IIa, 14
IIa, 22
IIa, 36
IIa, 39
IIc, 2
IIc, 8
IIc, 9
IIc, 10
IIc, 13
IId, 3
IId, 5
IId, 7
IId, 8
IId, 9
IId, 12
IId, 13
IId, 14
IId, 16
IId, 19
IId, 21
IIIa, 2
IIIa, 9
IIIa, 15
IIIa, 17
IIIa, 18
IIIa, 19
IIIa, 21
IIIa, 23
IIIa, 25
IIIa, 26
IIIa, 28
IIIa, 30
IIIa, 31
IIIa, 35
IIIa, 36
IIIa, 41
IIIa, 42
IIIa, 44
IIIa, 48
IIIa, 49
IIIa, 52
IIIa, 54
IIIb, 2
IIIb, 3
IIIb, 4
IVd, 3
IVd, 6
IVd, 8
IVd, 10
IVf, 1
IVf, 4
Navigation
[0] Message Index
[#] Next page
Go to full version