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Author Topic: Septimus Severus RIC 171A  (Read 642 times)

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jslade

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Septimus Severus RIC 171A
« on: August 27, 2021, 11:03:52 am »
Hello,

While at a show this summer I picked up several Denarii. One of these was a Denarius of Septimius Severus (RIC 171A).

I've subsequently been review some resources on counterfeiting and comparing my coins with what I'm seeing and that particular Denarius is starting to concern me. At first glance it just looks different from anything else in my collection. It's hard to describe why it looks "wrong" in-hand. The closest analog I can think of is that it looks like it was covered with a thin layer of silver paint. Here are some of my specific observations:
  - In the field immediately after AVG (11 - 12 o'clock) on the obverse there appears to be a long thin blob of extra metal
  - I can't find any flow lines on the obverse and only a few hints of them on the reverse
  - The weight, diameter, and die axis (3.29g, 19mm, 1) seem to be in line with what I found in the OCRE database for this coin
  - I cannot see any seam lines along the edge of the coin

I spent some time looking through Dr. Ilya Prokopov's Fake Ancient Coin Reports but I couldn't find a match for my coin so I started going through databases of authentic coins to see if I could learn more. It was on WildWinds that I found my coin and by that I don't mean a die match but my exact coin (2nd Image).

Despite seeing this coin in WildWinds I still have some reservation. I would be interested to know what the rest of you think.

Thanks in advance,

JSlade




Offline curtislclay

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Re: Septimus Severus RIC 171A
« Reply #1 on: August 27, 2021, 12:44:29 pm »
Nothing in the photo makes me doubt the coin.
Curtis Clay

Offline Ron C2

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Re: Septimus Severus RIC 171A
« Reply #2 on: August 29, 2021, 11:15:31 am »
It looks ok to me. Not sure how many severan denarii you have to compare to, but much debasement occurred throughout the dynasty.

This can make late coins from some mints feel much different from earlier ones in hand.
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jslade

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Re: Septimus Severus RIC 171A
« Reply #3 on: September 01, 2021, 02:54:30 pm »
Hi Curtis/Ron,

Thank you both for providing your feedback. As you noted, I have not had a chance to see a lot of these coins in-hand and am still learning what is typical. That, coupled with the fact that I've been immersing myself in reports of fake coins, has undoubtedly clouded my judgement a bit.

In the spirit of learning more about what is typical, I have taken some better close-up images of the "blobby" parts of the coin that were giving me heartburn and I was hoping that someone could provide some feedback on what was causing them. I had myself half convinced that they were caused by a modern overstrike of an older coin but there is probably a more benign explanation.

Thanks again for your feedback.

JSlade

Offline Ron C2

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Re: Septimus Severus RIC 171A
« Reply #4 on: September 01, 2021, 08:03:05 pm »
RIC 171A is not an uncommon septimius strike.  RIC lists it as common, and there were 58 examples in Reka Devnia.  To be frank, it's not a liklely candidate for a high grade fake

Your example, if fake, would have to have been made by striking with electro-typed dies.  It's too detailed for casting, and the style is too good for a modern carving.

The flattened spots along the legend are not an uncommon occurence, and it likely because this die was struck twice when the coin was originally forged.  It's not really a double-strike as the alignment remains good, but there was enough movement to shave down the letters on some of the obverse legend and flatten them out a bit

The rough field at 12 o'clock is likely just die corrosion. 

Really it's a nice example.

Here's another coin from the same issue from my collection that shows just how much stylistic variaety can exist and be considered correct style within a single issue.  Definitely carved by a different celator. 

https://www.forumancientcoins.com/gallery/displayimage.php?pid=170002
My Ancient Coin Gallery: Click here

R. Cormier, Ottawa

jslade

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Re: Septimus Severus RIC 171A
« Reply #5 on: September 01, 2021, 08:25:41 pm »
Hi Ron,

Thank you for explaining both of those features as well as your reasoning for why its unlikely this is a fake. It was very helpful.

Best,

JSlade

 

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