Author Topic: Is it real at all?--Driantilla? (Read 6852 times)

Vladimir · « **on:** May 30, 2007, 04:01:04 am »

what do u think?

Vladimir · « **Reply #1 on:** May 30, 2007, 04:02:17 am »

Pscipio · « **Reply #2 on:** May 30, 2007, 08:38:04 am »

Certainly modern, I'd say. All Dryantilla ants were overstruck on earlier silver, yours isn't. Besides, the lettering style looks completely modern to me.

Lars

Rupert · « **Reply #3 on:** May 30, 2007, 12:22:19 pm »

I'm sorry, but I agree with Lars.

Rupert

Vladimir · « **Reply #4 on:** May 30, 2007, 02:30:38 pm »

Quote from: Scipio Helveticus on May 30, 2007, 04:35:30 am

Tell me you havent dug this up in a field in Ukraine........

Well i didnt unfortunatly, but it is possible the present owner did. The coin is in Russia, and the seller wants around of $8000 for it -- I am sure its too much even for a real one.

Rupert · « **Reply #5 on:** May 30, 2007, 04:03:11 pm »

No doubt a real one in this condition would be worth it!

Rupert

Scipio Helveticus · « **Reply #6 on:** May 30, 2007, 04:12:00 pm »

Lars and Rupert are right. All of Regalianus' and Dryantilla's coinage was overstruck on mostly Severan denarii. Plus, they originate from Austria and not further east. With reagard to price, according to coinarchives, one example sold for over US$ 16,000.

"All of Regalianus. coinage has been attributed to a mint in Carnuntum (on the Danube between modern
Hainburg and Bratislava in Hungary). His wife was Sulpicia Dryantilla,
whose father, Sulpicius Pollio, was an officer under Caracalla. Regalianus
was killed by his own troops after a very short reign and Dryantilla most
likely shared his fate."

LordBest · « **Reply #7 on:** May 31, 2007, 01:38:22 am »

Here are the pictures,for those who cannot see them above.
LordBest.

gb29400 · « **Reply #8 on:** May 31, 2007, 02:29:54 am »

modern fake for me.
Not overstruck, letter too well engraved.

Guy

mauseus · « **Reply #9 on:** May 31, 2007, 03:22:24 am »

Hi,

Devils advocate. The style isn't too far away from one of the ones on Coinarchives (albeit with a different reverse type) apart from the lack of any traces of overstriking. Also, look on the reverse to the V in AVGG; it appears to be corroded in the way that some coins are so that the original surface around the letter remains but the letter itself is left as a rough sunken trace.

Regards,

Mauseus

jamesicus · « **Reply #10 on:** May 31, 2007, 03:28:24 am »

To my eye, the inscriptional letterforms are suspect.

James

mauseus · « **Reply #11 on:** May 31, 2007, 03:34:34 am »

Hi,

Given the irregular nature of the entire output then I wouldn't necessarily expect the coins of either Regalianus or Dryantilla to conform to the norm for the period.

Regards,

Mauseus

mwilson603 · « **Reply #12 on:** May 31, 2007, 06:36:55 am »

Just a thought, and you all know how I like to throw outlandish thoughts out there

These coins are all supposed to have been overstruck on existing coins, principally denarii. Now this one is bronze, or at least a base metal of some sort and therefore the immediate thought is that it cannot possibly be genuine.

However, given that there is such debate over the lettering, style etc, is it possible that this could be an overstruck fourree?

curtislclay · « **Reply #13 on:** May 31, 2007, 09:40:35 am »

This usurper's coinage is crude, but crude in a consistent way. This Dryantilla does not fit, and is a forgery in my opinion, with very clever patination.

Scipio Helveticus · « **Reply #14 on:** May 31, 2007, 10:40:32 am »

Quote from: mwilson603 on May 31, 2007, 06:36:55 am

However, given that there is such debate over the lettering, style etc, is it possible that this could be an overstruck fourree?

I have been looking at all the examples on coin archives and each shows the details to some degree of the host coin. Even if this was a fourree, some details would have presumably remained.....me thinx!

Quote from: curtislclay on May 31, 2007, 09:40:35 am

This usurper's coinage is crude, but crude in a consistent way. This Dryantilla does not fit, and is a forgery in my opinion, with very clever patination.

That seals it!!! Fake report submitted!!

thimar11 · « **Reply #15 on:** June 01, 2007, 03:41:23 am »

it's the 2nd time this coin is shown on this Forum :

https://www.forumancientcoins.com/board/index.php?topic=31099.0

it's a fake according to me : there is something odd in the style, the coin is not overstruck and more over, it was not struck with known dies...

Thibaut

basemetal · « **Reply #16 on:** June 01, 2007, 08:45:18 pm »

The sad part is that considering some of the tooled monstrosities that get $2500 without a blink,
this coin will eventually sell for a lot.
Mmmm...forgers don't usually produce just one coin. This person is or was dangerous.
Basemetal

gavignano · « **Reply #17 on:** June 02, 2007, 09:56:24 pm »

There are some things the forger did here that are very clever. The level of detail of wear on the face and hair for example. The neckline is very strange - for a moment it looked to me like someone altered a portrait of another person! The nose is unusual for a female, not really crude though. Was it already there?
Why the odd choice for the super large D in Dryantilla? I didn't come across this on any other dies.
Perplexing.

berserkrro · « **Reply #18 on:** June 03, 2007, 09:07:08 am »

The style and the corrosion are real. In my opinion this coin is OK (I saw many more coins in this status being real so if we don't have any sign of a fake we shouldn't pronounce this way). Although there is not another one matching with this one (or maybe just because of this), I'm sure is a real one. I'm not talking here about the price (which is a very good one - but not for me

).

Scipio Helveticus · « **Reply #19 on:** June 03, 2007, 09:40:26 am »

Quote from: berserkrro on June 03, 2007, 09:07:08 am

Although there is not another one matching with this one (or maybe just because of this), I'm sure is a real one.

As discussed above, the stlye is not consistent, and corrosion can be easily reproduced. In addition to this, I dont think because no other coins similar to this exist make it genuine. Is it logical for a forger to produce multiple forgeries of a coin of which only a few dozen exist? No. He would be caught out immiedietley by his own stlye. I dont think we'll see any others from this die again. It was a one off designed to make someone 16k at an auction.....

Gavignano, I agree that the nose does look like someone else's.......Septimus Severus'! But I think this is the result of the die rather than any pre-existing feature on the flan. And the "D" maybe the result of the die cutters inexperience. Once cut, it's not like you can take an eraser and rub it out!
Yet, like Bruce says, the forger is very, very good.

berserkrro · « **Reply #20 on:** June 03, 2007, 09:48:43 am »

I agree that it can be a "cannon strike". but I've never seen a fake done just for one selling. Anyway if is a fake (as you believe) is a very "technological" one. If somebody is able to do such coin, then is able to do any coin. Why isn't he working to some much vandable coins like aureus? We can imagine averything, but when the first time such coin occur, the discoverer is having an issue...think about that. I think is just another coin of Dryantilla...

Pscipio · « **Reply #21 on:** June 03, 2007, 09:52:31 am »

For the reasons named above, I'm sure this is a fake and not even an excellent one. Have you ever seen such an R on a roman coin? Besides, where are the overstrike signs? Apart from that, I actually think the coin isn't struck at all, rather pressed.

Lars

curtislclay · « **Reply #22 on:** June 03, 2007, 11:32:42 am »

The most ridiculous and impossible feature of the design is the stephane of Dryantilla, rendered as a mere outline rather than a solid object!

berserkrro · « **Reply #23 on:** June 03, 2007, 12:11:38 pm »

@Pscipio: Well, I didn't noticed those "R". yep, it's weird...I'll think about that
@Curtis Clay: what is a "stephane"? I'm not a native english speaker, sorry, anyway if you say that is wrong, I believe you, but please explain me what's wrong! Thank you!

curtislclay · « **Reply #24 on:** June 03, 2007, 12:13:47 pm »

Stephane = crown, tiara.

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Author Topic: Is it real at all?--Driantilla? (Read 6852 times)

Vladimir

Vladimir

Vladimir

Scipio Helveticus

jamesicus

Scipio Helveticus

basemetal

gavignano

Scipio Helveticus