Classical Numismatics Discussion
  Welcome Guest. Please login or register. 10% Off Store-Wide Sale Until 2 April!!! Explore Our Website And Find Joy In The History, Numismatics, Art, Mythology, And Geography Of Coins!!! Expert Authentication - Accurate Descriptions - Reasonable Prices - Coins From Under $10 To Museum Quality Rarities Welcome Guest. Please login or register. 10% Off Store-Wide Sale Until 2 April!!! Explore Our Website And Find Joy In The History, Numismatics, Art, Mythology, And Geography Of Coins!!! Support Our Efforts To Serve The Classical Numismatics Community - Shop At Forum Ancient Coins

New & Reduced


Author Topic: Iohannes or Avitus?  (Read 397 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Daniel-Alexandru B

  • Guest
Iohannes or Avitus?
« on: February 05, 2023, 10:52:58 am »
Could someone identify the bust type. On the obverse there are no readable letters, on the reverse readable is (V)ICTOR(IA AVGG). Thank you!

Offline Curtis JJ

  • Caesar
  • ****
  • Posts: 435
    • CONSERVATORI: Ancient Coins & Their Provenances
Re: Iohannes or Avitus?
« Reply #1 on: February 05, 2023, 12:16:56 pm »
Out of curiosity, how did you narrow it down to Avitus and Johannes? (It could be that the "E" in the left field narrows it down to only one or two emperors, I don't recall. I actually have one or more of the rev. type with that field mark. I've mentioned it before, but for the past 20 years I've been holding onto my big bags of tiny unidentified VLRBCs, or Very Late Roman Bronze Coins, for which I'm SO close to IDing a great rarity...but never get there. So if you can make it, that'll help me cross some off my list!)

Like the SALVS REIPVBLICAE (& ...CE) reverse from your other post, this reverse type / legend (or close variants) was used by a bunch of the very late Roman Emperors, including also scarce & rare ones like Theodosius II, Valentinian III, and Majorian. Depending on the number of G's at the end of the reverse legend, types were struck for Theodosius I, Honorius, Arcadius, Valentinian II. I'm sure others as well. (And there were contemporary "barbarian"/tribal imitations.)

The challenge of VLRBCs is that these tiny AE4s hardly ever have complete enough legends to be sure whose name they were struck under. That's why people will pay quite the large premium for any Johannes, Majorian, or Avitus with enough legend to be indisputable, and occasionally tremendous amounts for a complete legend.

In some cases, people have raised doubts about whether the coin types existed or are actually known at all (see, for example, Ras Suarez's 2014 essay on "The Avitus AE Problem" -- on his blog [LINK] -- by which he is actually referring to a much more general problem than just coins of that single ruler.)

Yours does have the "look" (style, fabric) of one of the later ones. Most of Theo I, Val II, Honorius and Arcadius are of better style, but some of the Arcadius AE4s (maybe others, too) were hastily and crudely struck. The Theo II (struck under Johannes) and Val III have this kind of appearance.

Again, if anything narrows it down (besides an outright die match on the portrait), I assume it'll be the "E" fieldmark left. (But, of course, I'd still be wondering if others used it too and we just don't have specimens good enough to know yet.)
“Collect the collectors…” John W Adams’ advice to J Orosz (Asylum 38, 2: p51)

Galleries https://www.forumancientcoins.com/gallery/index.php?cat=27154

 

All coins are guaranteed for eternity