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Author Topic: Green Encrustations  (Read 3506 times)

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Offline driekus

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Green Encrustations
« on: April 25, 2010, 07:52:55 pm »
I have a few coins that have this problem. They have this thick green encrustation like the photograph.  I need some advice on how to tackle cleaning them. I dont have any Dremmel tools, I have dental picks and diamond dusted dental picks. I have tried cleaning them mechanically with a dental pick, but have made a little bit of a butchered job of it. Does anyone have any advice on how to tackle these type of encrustations?

Offline slokind

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Re: Green Encrustations
« Reply #1 on: April 25, 2010, 08:29:38 pm »
That kind you call patina.  It's the other, powdery kind, the kind that, also, obscures detail rather than preserving it, that is BD.
Pat L.

Offline Arminius

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Re: Green Encrustations
« Reply #2 on: April 25, 2010, 08:37:12 pm »
Well, these powder-soft layers you call patina is no real patina but an oxidation layer that has to be stabilized before starting any cleaning attempt.

Depends how hard the patina layer on the coin is and how easy the dirt can be seperated. Sometimes this helps:

Soak the coin in alkaline weapons oil for a couple of days, maybe with some gentle heating-cooling cycles.
Then start brushing (selective if possible) with soft nylon brushes, using detergents under running water jets. Observe carefully how the dirt and the surface change. Stop if there is damage at the patina.
If you are lucky some dirt separates and the patina remains nearly unchanged.
Then start picking off the dirt at the sharp edges you created by the brushing procedures, using soft wooden sticks or a sharp but flexible steel blade (eg. scalpel).
If you are running out of sharp edges between dirt and patina the probability of causing damage increases. So repeat the brushing or the whole procedure to create new starting edges for mechanical cleaning.

Sometimes the higher parts can be cleaned just by brushing and the dirt remains in the lower fields of he coin - creating a "sand patina" like contrast.

If the patina is hard enough you might use harder nylon brushes or even soft brass brushes.

Sometimes the dirt and the patina can´t be separated this way cause they are completely mixed and grown together and there is no border line between any more. But that´s a different procedure

Offline driekus

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Re: Green Encrustations
« Reply #3 on: April 25, 2010, 08:46:43 pm »
These are definately separate encrustations. Parts where I have been successful in chipping off the green stuff have yielded nice pale green patina underneath. I will give the alkaline weapons oil a shot and see what it does. Im guessing you get it from a local gun shop?

Offline Arminius

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Re: Green Encrustations
« Reply #4 on: April 25, 2010, 08:57:43 pm »
These are definately separate encrustations. Parts where I have been successful in chipping off the green stuff have yielded nice pale green patina underneath. I will give the alkaline weapons oil a shot and see what it does. Im guessing you get it from a local gun shop?


For this part of the world: Where the huntsmen or the do-it-yourselfers go.

In Texas the availability might be different.  ;)

Offline larry c

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Re: Green Encrustations
« Reply #5 on: April 25, 2010, 09:02:25 pm »
Lack of gun oil in Texas ??
Surely you jest !!!
 ;D
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Offline casata137ec

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Re: Green Encrustations
« Reply #6 on: April 25, 2010, 10:08:54 pm »
Lack of gun oil in Texas ??
Surely you jest !!!
 ;D

lol...I think they even use gun oil for cooking in Texas!  ;D

Chris
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Offline driekus

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Re: Green Encrustations
« Reply #7 on: April 26, 2010, 09:25:07 pm »
Ok Ive thrown these coins back in TSP until I go and get myself some alkaline gun oil. I have only used toothbrush, dental picks and DI water so far. Now im prepared to take additional steps like alkaline gun oil. Who would have thought a chemist being reluctant to resort to more chemical techniques. :)
Yes alkaline gun oil is a little more difficult to get hold of in Canada. No cooking with gun oil here and using guns to turn off our lights. :) I will try a gun shop and see what they have.

Offline James Anderson

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Re: Green Encrustations
« Reply #8 on: April 28, 2010, 10:27:49 pm »
Some coin cleaners  have recommended a type of oil that is used on the valves and slides of musical instruments. If you can't find gun oil you might be able to find that.

Offline Mayadigger

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Re: Green Encrustations
« Reply #9 on: April 29, 2010, 06:39:00 pm »
Ave!

Amigo's, your way over-thinking this one.

It's just dirt over an excellent green patina.

Soak the coin in DW, then use your common/DDDP to remove the dirt.

Best,

Kevin
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Offline driekus

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Re: Green Encrustations
« Reply #10 on: April 30, 2010, 09:14:15 pm »
I have tried the whole DW and dental pick thing and it hasnt work. The encrustations are too solid and I seem to damage the patina when I chip away at it. I spent several hours on one and feel like I just butchered it.

Offline Jay GT4

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Re: Green Encrustations
« Reply #11 on: April 30, 2010, 09:29:29 pm »
Did you boil in DW or just let it soak?

Offline driekus

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Re: Green Encrustations
« Reply #12 on: April 30, 2010, 09:33:15 pm »
Just let em soak in rt deionized water.
How do you boil in DI water, I was a little worried heating the in a saucepan. How do you do it?

Offline renegade3220

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Re: Green Encrustations
« Reply #13 on: April 30, 2010, 09:45:43 pm »
In a saucepan!  ;D

I have only boiled a few personally, but I use about 3 tablespoons of Arm and Hammer Super Washing Soda per cup of DI H2O and boil for about 15 min.  I then let it cool and sit for 24 hrs.  Usually give them a very soft scrub while they are still hot. 

Honestly, when I did it, it didn't seem to help very much IMO.  Maybe someone has a better method but...

Offline Jay GT4

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Re: Green Encrustations
« Reply #14 on: April 30, 2010, 09:56:36 pm »
That's how I do it.  I recenty bought some Gringott's mix (See the Claudius bath thread) and it had excellent results.  It softened the Green encrustations so that it relatively easily came off but even with out the Gringott's a DW boil works wonders.  15-20 minutes...I've even done some longer but I usually brush and then place it back into the boiling water repeating as needed.

Offline driekus

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Re: Green Encrustations
« Reply #15 on: May 02, 2010, 06:44:29 pm »
Well I managed to get hold of some gun oil. I have to go to a conference for a week so I will let the coins soak for a week or so and see how I go.

Offline driekus

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Re: Green Encrustations
« Reply #16 on: May 09, 2010, 01:09:13 pm »
Excellent call on the gun oil. The green encrustations are just falling off. This was just a week without any heat. Will post some pics once I get them nice and clean

Offline Joe Sermarini

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Re: Green Encrustations
« Reply #17 on: May 23, 2010, 12:17:43 am »
Sounds to me like you are stripping the patina but I guess I should wait for the pics. 
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