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Author Topic: First Numismatic NFT Sold For Almost $21,000  (Read 1272 times)

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Offline Virgil H

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First Numismatic NFT Sold For Almost $21,000
« on: January 23, 2022, 08:45:07 pm »
I think it will be OK to post this Spink link: https://live.spink.com/live-auction/4-4KJC8U

A 'Non Fungible Penny'
A New Gold Penny of Henry III

The first Numismatic NFT Coin to be offered by an International Auction House, with proceeds being split over charities chosen by the vendor and Spink, specifically The Rodney Cook Memorial Fund and the Himal Foundation.

What was sold is a video of the rare coin:

Asset Name: Planta_genista_NFT_Ultra
File Format: mp4
Video Size: 76.7 Mb
Length: 00:00:08
Created by Spink design team

This lot is subject to 20% Buyer's Premium and applicable VAT.

It even comes with the buyer's fee. This is a digital asset only. The charity aspect is nice, but why anyone would by something like this is beyond me. Just donate to the charity and save the buyer's fee and VAT.

I have researched trying to sell NFTs as a fine art photographer. If people buy them, it is certainly easy money and a boon for artists and creators. But, my research revealed that this is a game for celebrities and rich folks. Not for regular plebes. The markets seem extremely speculative, and you don't even have tulip bulbs or worthless dot com stocks in hand. Seems like a way for rich folks to get richer, and celebrities to pad their incomes (Tiger Woods has gotten into it). I don't see a way for common folk to get in unless they get super lucky and that goes with both buying and selling. And I am bullish on crypto currencies like Bitcoin, but NFTs are a different ballgame.

Anyway, just my opinion, I know we have had a couple short discussions here about NFTs.

Regards,
Virgil

Offline esnible

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Re: First Numismatic NFT Sold For Almost $21,000
« Reply #1 on: January 23, 2022, 10:34:55 pm »
I recently tried to buy an NFT.  I found one I liked on an NFT sales site.  The price was right: ETH 0.0003, the equivalent of US$0.61.

It cost an additional $6 to withdraw $9 from coinbase.org and put the money in a wallet for spending on the NFT sales site.

When buying an NFT you must pay a "network fee".  I was confident I could buy a $0.61 NFT with the $9 in my wallet.  I was wrong.

On my first attempt, I got a message saying "network fees are high right now" due to "congestion".  To pay for my $0.61 transaction I am liable for a network fee of $97.96 to $130.70.

I tried again later.  This time the "network fee" is $68.32 to $90.37.

I know people who complain about $50 fees for $3000 coins sent by air over an entire ocean.  $97.96 in fees on a $0.61 transaction is quite mercenary!

I am glad the charities got the money in the Spink auction.  It is time for more transparency about the fees.

Offline Virgil H

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Re: First Numismatic NFT Sold For Almost $21,000
« Reply #2 on: January 23, 2022, 11:59:37 pm »
My understanding of the fees are they are called "gas fees" and not under the control of the specific marketplace. They go to the blockchain doing the transactions and I do know they vary based on network usage. For example, OpenSea is a marketplace. It is inexpensive to buy and sell there, except for the gas fees that they do not control. I can create an NFT, but I have to pay a first gas fee to do it and possibly another fee associated with moving the crypto coin into the wallet so it may be used. All the NFTs are using ETH, the coin of the Ethereum blockchain. Then I have to find a buyer. That is why celebrities are doing it, they have followings and fans and can get some hype going. In theory, it could be a great thing for artists and others. I am not sure where those gas fees are going, but there are costs for running the blockchains and, of course, the controllers are taking a cut. I don't understand it all for sure and am not ready to spend $100 to create an NFT of one of my photos that may or may not ever sell. And, obviously, my price would have to recoup the gas fees, which would drive up my price. Although, supposedly on OpenSea, the first gas fee is the only fee and it is not charged for further NFTs created. Somehow, these fees must be put under some kind of control. What you describe is a total turn off for buyers. Hopefully, my post made some sense, it is a new world and I am trying to figure it out like you are. I still wouldn't buy a coin NFT,  I might buy an avatar or something like that.

Regards,
Virgil

Offline Molinari

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Re: First Numismatic NFT Sold For Almost $21,000
« Reply #3 on: January 24, 2022, 12:54:45 pm »
I find it totally ridiculous but I'm saying that about a lot of things these days.

Offline SC

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Re: First Numismatic NFT Sold For Almost $21,000
« Reply #4 on: January 24, 2022, 04:18:14 pm »
I find it totally ridiculous but I'm saying that about a lot of things these days.

A sign you are getting old.  Welcome to the club!

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Offline Mat

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Re: First Numismatic NFT Sold For Almost $21,000
« Reply #5 on: January 24, 2022, 04:36:10 pm »
I'm almost 43 and still don't get the point of it & seems like a giant waste of money.

South Park recently did a special on how ridiculous the concept is.
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Offline Meepzorp

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Re: First Numismatic NFT Sold For Almost $21,000
« Reply #6 on: January 24, 2022, 05:34:11 pm »
I find it totally ridiculous but I'm saying that about a lot of things these days.

A sign you are getting old.  Welcome to the club!

SC

Hi folks,

I agree with both of you, and I am 54 years old.

Meepzorp

Offline Meepzorp

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Re: First Numismatic NFT Sold For Almost $21,000
« Reply #7 on: January 24, 2022, 05:41:30 pm »
Quote from: Mat on January 24, 2022, 04:36:10 pm
I...don't get the point of it & seems like a giant waste of money.

Hi folks,

I agree. Why would someone want to pay all of that money ($21,000 or more) for a photo of something? I would rather own the object itself. The photo may cost more money than the actual object. People really need to stop carrying on with all of this ridiculousness. What happens when the investor/speculation bubble bursts (as it inevitably will)? People will be left with a worthless photo of something (instead of the actual object itself).

Meepzorp

Offline Mat

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Re: First Numismatic NFT Sold For Almost $21,000
« Reply #8 on: January 24, 2022, 05:54:31 pm »
Quote from: Meepzorp on January 24, 2022, 05:41:30 pm
Quote from: Mat on January 24, 2022, 04:36:10 pm
I...don't get the point of it & seems like a giant waste of money.

Hi folks,

I agree. Why would someone want to pay all of that money ($21,000 or more) for a photo of something? I would rather own the object itself. The photo may cost more money than the actual object. People really need to stop carrying on with all of this ridiculousness. What happens when the investor/speculation bubble bursts (as it inevitably will)? People will be left with a worthless photo of something (instead of the actual object itself).

Meepzorp

Exactly, that's what South Park was making a point about. It's done in a funny way but also makes a giant point across.

I want to own the psychical object too.

Oh well, I will continue to enjoy my coins, autographs, & comic books.
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Offline William S7

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Re: First Numismatic NFT Sold For Almost $21,000
« Reply #9 on: January 26, 2022, 11:17:41 am »
Haha - I saw this coming a year ago :) It won't be long I think and the entire numismatic hobby will be transformed by this trend. https://www.forumancientcoins.com/board/index.php?topic=124033.0

Offline SC

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Re: First Numismatic NFT Sold For Almost $21,000
« Reply #10 on: January 26, 2022, 11:31:29 am »
To me there is a huge difference between an NFT and the use of blockchain technology for authentication.

I don't see NFTs, at least in the form they are now, going anywhere.  As someone already pointed out they may continue to be a plaything for the wealthy (and/or clueless) but I don't believe that any real coin collectors will all of sudden take up buying images of coins instead of real coins.

The use of blockchain tech for authentication etc. is possible.  Maybe even related to the images of a coin - say using blockchain tech to "lock down" and secure an image file that displays the coin and its description, grading and provenance.  However, it would only take off if it was about a tool to authenticate a real coin not to substitute ownership of an image for a real coin.  And, as noted above, due to the nature of blockchain tech it would incure a cost - so it would be a bit like paying for an authentication, grading and slabbing service.  Costly and possibly adds value to the coin.

However, I have been wrong before.  In the late 1990s I thought that the new reality TV craze was a flash in the pan - no way our society would be shallow enough to keep watching this horrible useless crap.  Now I wish I had bought stocks........

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Offline Virgil H

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Re: First Numismatic NFT Sold For Almost $21,000
« Reply #11 on: January 26, 2022, 08:24:24 pm »
I basically love all the comments here and I agree with them all. LOL. I am not buying anything I can't hold, but I would sell my photo NFTs all day long. I am just not rich or well known enough to do it. I do think it is a huge bubble just waiting to happen. I did own some penny stocks in garden.com back in the late 90s before that bubble burst. Yet, as Shawn said, as authentication (and that is all the NFT thing is about) has uses. And I am 66.

Virgil

Offline n.igma

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Re: First Numismatic NFT Sold For Almost $21,000
« Reply #12 on: January 26, 2022, 09:45:39 pm »
The game of separating fools from their money has a long history, I dare say dating back at least 2,600 years. NFT's  represent but another version of the game.

Maybe I should sell that piece of wisdom as an NFT?
All historical inquiry is contingent and provisional, and our own prejudices will in due course come under scrutiny by our successors.

Offline n.igma

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Re: First Numismatic NFT Sold For Almost $21,000
« Reply #13 on: January 26, 2022, 10:45:41 pm »
The smug Spink salesman (aka numismatic specialist) can barely conceal his smile in announcing the NFT  https://youtu.be/lZm-uYyQoII

Smiling all the way to the bank on the NFT with the 20% buyer's premium (GBP 3,000) plus a GBP 15,000 tax deduction for the charitable donation! 

Meanwhile the real deal sold for GPB 540,000 plus juice (20% = GBP108,000) https://youtu.be/fc0wgKgFPz0

All up, Spink boosted its take on the authentic coin's buyer premium by around 3% through the NFT sale before consideration of the tax offset afforded by the GBP 15 K charitable donation.

Given the margin uplift that results from this NFT exercise, expect to see a lot more of the same from the high end dealers.

So not only does the NFT approach separate fools from their money, it separates the UK Exchequer from its money via the tax offset of the charitable donation from the NFT sale!

What a scam! But all quite legal (at present).
All historical inquiry is contingent and provisional, and our own prejudices will in due course come under scrutiny by our successors.

Offline Virgil H

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Re: First Numismatic NFT Sold For Almost $21,000
« Reply #14 on: January 26, 2022, 10:48:09 pm »
Great points n.igma. The buyer's fee is equivalent to the Ethereum "gas fees" I mentioned in an earlier post, I suppose. Someone is going to make money and WC Fields was right: "It is morally wrong to allow a sucker to keep his money." And everyone making money with this stuff is laughing all the way to the bank. I am just trying to figure out how I can become one of those laughing because there are some real coins I would love to buy AND HOLD in my hand. LOL. I am wise enough to know it isn't going to happen.

Virgil

Offline William S7

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Re: First Numismatic NFT Sold For Almost $21,000
« Reply #15 on: January 27, 2022, 08:19:48 pm »
I wonder how long before the premium Eid Mar coins out there get turned into NFT's? Just a matter of time I think.

 

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