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Author Topic: Rare semis? of Augustus from Carthage  (Read 171 times)

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Offline Bebek2006

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Rare semis? of Augustus from Carthage
« on: September 12, 2022, 01:40:36 pm »
Hi,
I have bought rare semis from Carthage (RPC I 750, Alexandropoulos 104), and now i can't find another coin like this in any past auction...
Have you ever seen this specimen for sale?
And can you tell me, why this coin was struck on the half of AS?



Offline shanxi

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Re: Rare semis? of Augustus from Carthage
« Reply #1 on: September 12, 2022, 01:49:31 pm »

Offline Bebek2006

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Re: Rare semis? of Augustus from Carthage
« Reply #2 on: September 12, 2022, 02:07:26 pm »

Offline Meepzorp

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Re: Rare semis? of Augustus from Carthage
« Reply #3 on: September 12, 2022, 03:35:47 pm »
why this coin was struck on the half of AS?

Hi Bebek,

It may not have been struck on half an As. Usually, these coins were cut in half sometime after they were struck.

Meepzorp

Offline Meepzorp

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Re: Rare semis? of Augustus from Carthage
« Reply #4 on: September 12, 2022, 03:39:10 pm »
Hi Bebek,

I recently (a few months ago) purchased a Roman Provincial coin of Augustus that was struck in Cyrene, which is also in north Africa. Like your coin, it depicts a sella seat.

Here is my example (first coin):

https://www.forumancientcoins.com/meepzorp/rp_cyrenaica_cyrrhestica.htm

Meepzorp

Offline Bebek2006

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Re: Rare semis? of Augustus from Carthage
« Reply #5 on: September 13, 2022, 12:29:26 pm »
Thanks for reply.
Today i hit an idea, that this coin could be struck with die with cutter in the middle, and dies use to struck this specimen looked like on the picture which i have attached.
I think thats could be true, becaus all of this coins (from RPC 749 to RPC 751) are known only as cuted in a half, and RPC 751 - right half, shows the same things (curulis and patera) as left half - RPC 749/50.

Offline Lech Stępniewski

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Re: Rare semis? of Augustus from Carthage
« Reply #6 on: September 13, 2022, 02:07:37 pm »
this coin could be struck with die with cutter in the middle

How such die with cutter could work? Cut and strike at the same time? Why not accept the simplest solution: coins were normally struck and THEN cut.
Lech Stępniewski
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Poland

Offline Bebek2006

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Re: Rare semis? of Augustus from Carthage
« Reply #7 on: September 14, 2022, 12:03:50 pm »
I have found an article, which tells abot this coin:
Local Coinage and Civic Identity in Roman North Africa pages 12-13

"The semisses are particularly interesting, as they were minted at the
same size as the asses, but then purposefully cut in half, with an obverse and
reverse design that was a mirror image, giving both halves the same designs.
This is an unusual design for semisses, and it is uncertain why Carthage chose to
mint them in this way, as well as why they did not mint them in the same manner
later on during the reign of Tiberius."


this coin could be struck with die with cutter in the middle

How such die with cutter could work? Cut and strike at the same time?
Yes.

Why not accept the simplest solution: coins were normally struck and THEN cut.
I don't reject that, but all this coins were cut in the same place - on the middle from 12 to 6 hour and all leters are full visable. When you compare the cut edge of RPC 749, 750, 751 and my coin, you can see that all this coins were cut from obverse, not from reverse. If the cutting process was made after coin was struck, some of this semisses should have deficiences in legend, or should be cut in wrong place or cuting could be started from reverse, because human is not a machine and can make mistakes...

Offline Lech Stępniewski

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Re: Rare semis? of Augustus from Carthage
« Reply #8 on: September 14, 2022, 01:26:05 pm »
I don't reject that, but all this coins were cut in the same place

I still see some difficulties:
- the flan is often larger than the die, so how could it be cut?;
- the flan would have to be held extraordinarily tightly, as the impact of the cutter would cause the flan to bend.

It would be much simpler to engrave a thin line on the obverse die as a mark for the further cutting.
Lech Stępniewski
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Poland

Offline Pekka K

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Re: Rare semis? of Augustus from Carthage
« Reply #9 on: September 14, 2022, 02:05:34 pm »

NB. obverse die was on anvil side, so your picture is not correct.

Pekka K

Offline Bebek2006

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Re: Rare semis? of Augustus from Carthage
« Reply #10 on: September 14, 2022, 03:59:42 pm »
Thanks for all answers!


NB. obverse die was on anvil side, so your picture is not correct.

Pekka K
Mea culpa. :-X

It would be much simpler to engrave a thin line on the obverse die as a mark for the further cutting.
Hmmm... it's a good idea, probably you're right.


regards,
Karol



 

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