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Author Topic: Roman Bronze Palm Thimble 100 - 300 A.D.  (Read 743 times)

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Offline Joe Sermarini

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Roman Bronze Palm Thimble 100 - 300 A.D.
« on: September 30, 2022, 12:22:27 pm »
The object below is identified by the consignor as a Roman bronze palm thimble, 100 - 300 A.D.  I find many similar objects for sale identified the same way, but I have not found a reference to an excavation or a museum collection. I have seen many objects misdescribed over and over by sellers. I don't have confidence in the description. Is it really a thimble? Anyone known of a reference?
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Offline SC

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Re: Roman Bronze Palm Thimble 100 - 300 A.D.
« Reply #1 on: September 30, 2022, 03:51:34 pm »
Never heard of such a device in Roman times nor have I seen anything that looks like this.

Are there holes in those lugs?

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(Shawn Caza, Ottawa)

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Re: Roman Bronze Palm Thimble 100 - 300 A.D.
« Reply #2 on: October 01, 2022, 10:38:28 pm »
A string was supposedly passed through the holes to bind the thimble on the hand to the palm. I ran into a sketch or photo of how it was worn when I browsed for Roman palm thimble (but I did not bookmark the URL). It was a sales listing.
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Offline Virgil H

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Re: Roman Bronze Palm Thimble 100 - 300 A.D.
« Reply #3 on: October 02, 2022, 12:10:18 am »
I have no experience with these, but if you look at it and imagine it in use, it makes sense. I have done some leather work in the past where I would have loved to have something like this for hole punching without destroying my hand and palm. It would allow one to use a large punch/needle and apply greater force than an awl with a handle. If you ever used an awl with a handle you can still hurt your hand with it. This device would distribute the force much better. Certainly items like this were used into modern times, as well. A quick search of palm thimbles reveals they are still used and sold and used for pushing large needles through thick leather/fabrics. There is Japanese technique where the needles cannot have handles, so must be pushed through using a device so it doesn't put a hole through your hand. Interesting.

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Offline Pekka K

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Re: Roman Bronze Palm Thimble 100 - 300 A.D.
« Reply #4 on: October 02, 2022, 01:39:43 am »
Joe, did you see this sketch from ex VCoins dealer "Ancient Caesar Classical Numismatics"?

Offline Virgil H

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Re: Roman Bronze Palm Thimble 100 - 300 A.D.
« Reply #5 on: October 02, 2022, 02:00:15 am »
Pekka,
A larger image would be more helpful, that one is hard to really see. But, some of the modern palm thimbles I saw when I looked it up are remarkably similar. I guess the point is that palm thimbles are a real thing and there are only so many ways to make them over the centuries. They basically help you apply pressure without having something impale your hand.

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Offline Pekka K

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Re: Roman Bronze Palm Thimble 100 - 300 A.D.
« Reply #6 on: October 02, 2022, 02:27:28 am »

This sketch was copied many years ago, when I got my thimble and
found similar on sale.

Here is my thimble:

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Re: Roman Bronze Palm Thimble 100 - 300 A.D.
« Reply #7 on: October 04, 2022, 02:29:36 pm »
My doubt stems from this page: https://finds.org.uk/counties/findsrecordingguides/textile-equipment/#Palm_guards

The UK portable antiquities scheme find reporting guide lists many types of thimbles, including palm guards. None look like these types.
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Offline Mayadigger

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Re: Roman Bronze Palm Thimble 100 - 300 A.D.
« Reply #8 on: October 07, 2022, 12:22:38 pm »
Ave!

Palm thimbles were most commonly used by sailmakers and leather workers. It was tied around the hand and tucked into the palm and used by setting the eye end of a needle against the recessed end and pushing the needle using the entire arm. This allowed the sewer to use a great amount of force without hurting the hand while pushing a thick needle through tough materials like leather, canvas or sail cloth.

I have had a few Roman needles, and all were ca. 17cm. Sadly, I cannot find any photos to share.  :'(
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Re: Roman Bronze Palm Thimble 100 - 300 A.D.
« Reply #9 on: October 07, 2022, 05:45:38 pm »
Joe, did you see this sketch from ex VCoins dealer "Ancient Caesar Classical Numismatics"?

Yes. I generally do not accept sale listings as references. I want something from an archeological report, museum catalog or other more authoritative reference. There are many items described as Roman over and over and over, in multiple sales listings by multiple sellers, that are not Roman or ancient at all.

For example: https://www.forumancientcoins.com/board/index.php?topic=121062.0

I have actually ordered a book on thimbles ancient to modern and they mention palm thimbles in the description.
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Offline Joe Sermarini

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Re: Roman Bronze Palm Thimble 100 - 300 A.D.
« Reply #10 on: October 13, 2022, 08:38:26 pm »
I received the book Metal Sewing Thimbles Found in Britain, by Brian Read. No thimbles that look like these. All the palm thimbles are round and disc-like.
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Offline Mario T

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Re: Roman Bronze Palm Thimble 100 - 300 A.D.
« Reply #11 on: November 15, 2022, 09:46:32 am »
ex

Offline Mario T

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Re: Roman Bronze Palm Thimble 100 - 300 A.D.
« Reply #12 on: November 15, 2022, 09:47:09 am »
ex

Offline Mario T

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Re: Roman Bronze Palm Thimble 100 - 300 A.D.
« Reply #13 on: November 15, 2022, 09:47:35 am »
ex

Offline Joe Sermarini

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Re: Roman Bronze Palm Thimble 100 - 300 A.D.
« Reply #14 on: November 15, 2022, 09:56:24 am »
The question remains. Are they Roman?
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Offline Mario T

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Re: Roman Bronze Palm Thimble 100 - 300 A.D.
« Reply #15 on: November 15, 2022, 10:31:19 am »
Sorry I am not able to indicate whether this type is roman or not

 

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