FORVM`s Classical Numismatics Discussion Board
Numismatic and History Discussion Forums => Ancient Coin Forum => Topic started by: aramnave on April 07, 2013, 03:37:50 pm
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Does anyone have an update on if and when The Celator will resume publishing or shipping? Has anyone received any issues this calendar year?
At the New York show the publisher, Kerry W. indicated that the magazine would be posting shortly but that was three months ago and I at least have not received anything.
Thanks for any insight that can be offered.
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Spoke to Kerry Thursday and he asked me for my final copy of an add I'm running in the next issue for Triskeles Auctions. He said it will be at the printers before the Chicago international in 2 weeks.
Barry Murphy
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Spoke to Kerry Thursday and he asked me for my final copy of an add I'm running in the next issue for Triskeles Auctions. He said it will be at the printers before the Chicago international in 2 weeks.
Barry Murphy
Thats some good news +++
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+++ +++
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Update:
May 26. I have yet to receive an issue since the last post. Has anyone here received one or heard more news?
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aramnave,
Look here for the latest info we have:
https://www.forumancientcoins.com/board/index.php?topic=77629.0 (https://www.forumancientcoins.com/board/index.php?topic=77629.0)
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^ Glad to see at least some encouraging news in there. I wasn't aware that it had continued issuing so recently. It's a worthy enough venture that, if not on too slim a budget, seems to me worth supporting.
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The Celator Magazine
After more than 25 years, the publication of The Celator Magazine has come to an end. Due to some health issues, Kerry can no longer manage the publication of a monthly magazine. He was hoping to have at least one more issue but at this point he is unable to continue. Kerry would like to extend a warm, heartfelt thank you to all of his subscribers for their patience and understanding over the last year and to the many of you who sent him your prayers and wishes for a speedy recovery. Kerry's condition is not life threatening, but it severely hinders his ability to work at a computer, which makes the publication of a magazine impossible. I would like to say thank you to Kerry for his tireless efforts over the last 13 years in producing The Celator and I wish him a full and quick recovery and good luck in the future.
Kerry's brother Kerby has been helping him recently with emails, so many of you may have received a reply from Kerby. If you would like to send a note to Kerry, you can also send them directly to me at bpmurphy@vcoins.com and I will see that he receives them.
On a similar note, Kerry has informed me that he is considering offers to buy The Celator Magazine. Kerry doesn't want the magazine to go to just anyone. A strong background in numismatics, graphic design and layout are a must. If anyone has an interest in taking over the magazine, you can send me your name and contact information and I will see that Kerry gets it.
Barry Murphy
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That's unfortunate. When I spoke to him last, he was quite upbeat and hopeful that the Celator would return soon. I'm very sorry to hear that his health is not allowing him to continue. I wish him only the best.
Tom
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Very sad news. I hope someone buys it and starts publishing again. I'll resubscribe.
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I hate to sound mean though the money is not important just the principal is he offering a refund on monies sent for a subscription as I know I paid for 2 years and got about 4 issues out of it.
It's a shame to see it go.
If not its not a big deal but a little surprised no one mentioned it here.
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I hate to sound mean though the money is not important just the principal is he offering a refund on monies sent for a subscription as I know I paid for 2 years and got about 4 issues out of it.
It's a shame to see it go.
If not its not a big deal but a little surprised no one mentioned it here.
Maybe you'll get a refund if you ask or maybe he is planning on making good on refunds in general. I'm not going to ask. He must be in pretty bad shape if he's giving up on the Celator.
I wonder, what price range is a journal like this? Thousands, tens of thousands, even higher?
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I'd first like to sympathise with Kerry; it was already disclosed to us on Forvm some time back, with Kerry's permission, that a stroke or similar was the issue. I suffered a very serious stroke a few years back and never recovered and have been unable ever to resume paid employment (hence I spend a lot of time bugging you guys on Forvm). So I do feel for Kerry, and fully understand that even when outwardly ok (able to converse etc), it's another step higher to producing a tangible product.
I wonder, what price range is a journal like this?
I'd imagine a lower range though I might be wrong about the intellectual property values. There's no cashflow from the magazine at the moment, or for a long time, and if restored in the same format it's tough to imagine there's much there either. If there was, other magazines would have taken over the space, or perhaps they are already taking over (I now subscribe to the UK's Coin World, which does ancients too). The value probably is in the contact list of advertisers and subscribers; even the latter may be limited by it being a physical magazine rather than email, and the former are all digital. There's some value in old articles, but as we see with Minerva putting them all for free online, any article has its sell by date. One could imagine an energetic restoration of some combined web/paper format, perhaps combined with an existing platform, but the main energy would be by the new developers which suggests the cash value to purchase the rights may be limited. So, if you are thinking of making a bid, go for it!
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When I talk to Kerry next, I'll ask him about refunds. I don't know what the general policy is for magazines that go out of business so I won't speculate. I know I'm not asking for one and I had just renewed for 2 years. It's not enough for me to worry about.
Concerning value, the magazine business is a dyeing business. Even the big magazines are struggling. Printing and postage costs have gotten too high and advertisers aren't willing to advertise in print format like they used to. I don't think The Celator made much in the last few years as the increased expenses ate away at what little profit there was. The Celator's subscription base was only about 2000 subscribers so I don't know what value the mail list would have in terms of new names. If someone is seriously interested in buying the Celator let me know and I will forward Kerry the info and he will discuss it with you directly. I don't know if there are any assets and I don't know the actual cash flow, so guessing at a value isn't possible and I'm not going to speculate as to what sort of value Kerry puts on the company.
Barry Murphy
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Last month I asked for, and received, a refund for my two-year subscription. I dealt with Kerby (Kerry's brother), who was very helpful.
Like everyone here I wish Kerry well and am grateful for years of enjoyable reading. I am glad I saved all of my copies. I expect I will be rereading them from cover to cover for years ahead, even long after the URL's written up in Barry and Beasley's "The Internet Connection" have gone inactive.
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I have to say thanks to the Celator for years of great stuff!! Its too bad the internet has swallowed some things up, it was and is a valuable resource. Celator will be missed.
Joe
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Thinking on it a couple of days, perhaps it may be worthwhile Kerry's family to contact one of the glossy coin magazines (the Numismatist, and/or Coin World, perhaps both, for the US and Europe) and ask whether they would be interested to fulfil part or all of remainder subscriptions with copies of their own magazines, in return for which the glossy mag(s) get 2000 new likely subscribers, and the entire contact list, advert list etc., as well as the ability to use the Celator name inside their own glossy; the subscribers are happy at getting some coin magazine rather than none, Kerry exits with happy subscribers and no further obligations whilst keeping pre-paid sub amounts, and the other mags get to ramp up their subscription base substantially at a small incremental cost of mailing out some free issues, perhaps making sure to have an ancients column each month. Just a thought.
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Not only that but Kerry must have had several articles in the pipeline for future issues. Those could possibly go to another magazine too for publishing.
Shawn
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Has anyone heard if someone purchased the Celator magazine? The last I heard Kerry had stopped publication and was considering selling it. Just curious if anyone did.
I'm mainly asking because this magazine was my all time favorite. I always looked forward to reading the articles and it was a great research tool. Since it ceased publication, I have yet to see another publication that fills the void. Can anyone recommend any other ancient coin magazines? I know a few of the modern coin magazines have small sections for ancients where occasionally snippets are published, but it's obviously not the same as a publication devoted to our favorite hobby.
What do our fellow members feel about the fate of the Celator? Would anyone like to see such a magazine in the near future, be it digital or hard copy?
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What do our fellow members feel about the fate of the Celator? Would anyone like to see such a magazine in the near future, be it digital or hard copy?
I wish it was still around. Numismatist magazine is OK but doesn't fill the void left by Celator. I would love to see another ancient magazine surface.
I would think digital would be cheaper.
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I truly looked forward to receiving The Celator every month. Its absence has left a great void in the sharing of knowledge and research in the ancients collecting arena.
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I recently bought an entire run of the Celator. ;D
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Magazines in general not just coin magazines have had a hard time in the last decade. I stopped reading the Celator long before it ceased publication I believe because the place in my life it once occupied (beginning when it was newspaper format) had been supplanted by online activities including Forvm, several discussion groups (Numism-L and later) and websites including my own. The Celator was not cheap largely due to postage. I assume most articles were donated (I never even received a free subscription for my articles but Wayne did send a couple extras of the issues my pieces were in).
Today the free online material is a hundred times greater than it was when I bailed on the Celator. I can find articles on subjects of interest to me by searching Google more easily than I ever could using indices of back issues. What would a 2016 magazine be able to do that would make me want to pay postage let alone production costs? Much of the online material is paid for by sellers of coins who have much to gain out of promoting the hobby in general. Beginners who collect $20 bronzes today will provide a later generation of high end collectors and employees/owners of the big name houses. A paper magazine would be read by a small fraction of the target market (well to do buyers in 2050?) compared to those reached online by so much free material.
Certainly some of us would support any paper or electronic effort and wish well those willing to put a lot of work into it. However I see it as a huge amount of work (judging from my experience when I was updating my web page weekly from 1997-2003). I do not see it as a golden egg waiting to be harvested. It would require someone who probably could make a success in several other ways to apply Herculean effort for the cause and the 'good' of the hobby. It will be interesting to see what volunteers come forward.
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Has anyone heard if someone purchased the Celator magazine? The last I heard Kerry had stopped publication and was considering selling it. Just curious if anyone did.
I'm mainly asking because this magazine was my all time favorite. I always looked forward to reading the articles and it was a great research tool. Since it ceased publication, I have yet to see another publication that fills the void. Can anyone recommend any other ancient coin magazines? I know a few of the modern coin magazines have small sections for ancients where occasionally snippets are published, but it's obviously not the same as a publication devoted to our favorite hobby.
What do our fellow members feel about the fate of the Celator? Would anyone like to see such a magazine in the near future, be it digital or hard copy?
I miss The Celator very much as well, it was always a joy to receive in the mailbox. It's not the same, but I have been filling that void somewhat by picking up issues of the magazine Minerva (Fantastic UK magazine on archaeology, with some decent coin related content) for awhile now. I find Minerva at my local Barnes & Noble, but it is an obscure magazine and I'm always worried they'll stop carrying it. But I cannot recommend Minerva highly enough, it is very well done.
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Has anyone heard if someone purchased the Celator magazine? The last I heard Kerry had stopped publication and was considering selling it. Just curious if anyone did.
I'm mainly asking because this magazine was my all time favorite. I always looked forward to reading the articles and it was a great research tool. Since it ceased publication, I have yet to see another publication that fills the void. Can anyone recommend any other ancient coin magazines? I know a few of the modern coin magazines have small sections for ancients where occasionally snippets are published, but it's obviously not the same as a publication devoted to our favorite hobby.
What do our fellow members feel about the fate of the Celator? Would anyone like to see such a magazine in the near future, be it digital or hard copy?
I don't think there is a market for such a magazine any more. There's no digital market, as with so much free information on ancient coins, I doubt anyone would pay for it. And there's no print market either. The mass-market print market today is fulfilled by either glossy magazines such as Coin World (which runs one or two ancient articles per issue), or by glossy society journals such as the ANS quarterly, or the ANA numismatist (likewise in both cases), or Minerva (ditto). Each of these has articles rather like the Celator used to run, except fewer of them. Italy still has a Celator-like print magazine (Panorama Numismatica) with mid-brow articles devoted to ancients, but that's a special case with widespread interest and many people writing articles. At the upper level, the academic journals do fine. Much of the Celator like content can now be found free on the web, so people are paying for glossies with wider circulation only, which really allows for just a couple of articles on ancients per issue as that wide circulation can only be procured by also selling many copies to collectors of modern coins. So, there'll never be a Celator or any other equivalent English language publication again in my view. The main remaining asset in the Celator is I think it's back articles, groups of which would merit publication in book format, or on a case by case basis abridged versions in a glossy such as Coin World, and it's distribution list details, though the latter quickly goes out of date.
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Hi Andrew,
While I respect your opinion, I disagree that there isn't a market for said magazine. I'm not saying there would be a huge amount of subscribers, but nonetheless there's a niche market. I understand Celator had two thousand subscribers or so when it suddenly vanished. I agree there is some content to be found on the internet but I don't see the quality in comparison to well researched articles that appeared regularly in the Celator.
Having a Classics background, I agree there is a decent amount of what you refer to as "mid-brow" or "upper" academic journals which appear to be stable and consistent. To me though, the Celator was always readable, and in my mind kept the hobby alive and reachable for the common collector and not just for high profile collectors and investors. Many of the scholarly journals can be quite dry and I thought this magazine injected some fun and depth into the hobby that many consider to be just for archaeologists and scholars.
Perhaps the future of a publication like this would be best suited in digital format?
I'd like to take a poll by our fellow members here to see if they'd like to see a similar magazine surface in the near future.
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Hi Andrew,
While I respect your opinion, I disagree that there isn't a market for said magazine. I'm not saying there would be a huge amount of subscribers, but nonetheless there's a niche market. I understand Celator had two thousand subscribers or so when it suddenly vanished. I agree there is some content to be found on the internet but I don't see the quality in comparison to well researched articles that appeared regularly in the Celator.
Having a Classics background, I agree there is a decent amount of what you refer to as "mid-brow" or "upper" academic journals which appear to be stable and consistent. To me though, the Celator was always readable, and in my mind kept the hobby alive and reachable for the common collector and not just for high profile collectors and investors. Many of the scholarly journals can be quite dry and I thought this magazine injected some fun and depth into the hobby that many consider to be just for archaeologists and scholars.
Perhaps the future of a publication like this would be best suited in digital format?
I'd like to take a poll by our fellow members here to see if they'd like to see a similar magazine surface in the near future.
I would love to see it or similar surface. Coin world and numismatist don't cut it. They're ok but I liked all ancient coverage better
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I'd like to take a poll by our fellow members here to see if they'd like to see a similar magazine surface in the near future.
in print i definitely would.
digital? i wouldn't bother.
~ Peter
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I'd like to take a poll by our fellow members here to see if they'd like to see a similar magazine surface in the near future.
in print i definitely would.
digital? i wouldn't bother.
~ Peter
Me too.
You have to remember that the type of people that subscribe are the type of people that usually prefer print to digital. Especially since they are collectors, so they like "things".
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I'd like to take a poll by our fellow members here to see if they'd like to see a similar magazine surface in the near future.
I have no doubt, our members would say they want it. But it does not matter. Nobody is going to respond to the poll results - unless they want to work for minimum wage. That is probably why nobody took over the Celator when it closed.
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I'd like to take a poll by our fellow members here to see if they'd like to see a similar magazine surface in the near future.
I have no doubt, our members would say they want it. But it does not matter. Nobody is going to respond to the poll results - unless they want to work for minimum wage. That is probably why nobody took over the Celator when it closed.
I approached Kerry about buying it when it was imploding, but he wasn't interested.
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I approached Kerry about buying it when it was imploding, but he wasn't interested.
I am surprised, both that you would want to take on the challenge, and that he wasn't interested.
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Hello All,
I know this is an old topic but just curious how others feel about Kerry Wetterstrom receiving the ANA's Farran Zerbe Memorial Award for Distinguished Service. I appreciate that Kerry has done an amazing amount of work in the world of ancient coins and running the Celator for 13 years was a great accomplishment but how he handled the closing of the Celator still bothers me and leaves a mark on his record. Like many I was a long time subscriber to the Celator and loved it. Just before Kerry announced the closing of the magazine I renewed for two more years. I never heard a single word directly from Kerry, his brother, etc. on the ending of the magazine or what they planned to do with the money from subscriptions. It wasn't a lot of money but Kerry when he was finally able to resume work have, and in my opinion should have, reached out to subscribers to come to some resolution to close out the business.
I read the August 2021 ANA's Numismatist: 'However, with the advent of the Internet came the downfall of The Celator. "I thoroughly enjoyed editing it," Wetterstrom explains, "but as a one-person person operation, I decided I didn't have the energy and knowledge to take it online." He bid adieu to his labor of love in 2012, and the following year, he returned to CNG as a senior numismatist, a position he still holds today.'
I'm sensitive on this topic as I went through long and tough battle with cancer and over a decade of treatments and follow ups. During this time no matter how sick I was I didn't let the illness impact my responsibilities towards others. I still contacted everyone, explained the situation and did all I could to honor my obligations. Each person is different and I don't know Terry's personal situation, legal concerns, etc. but it sure would have been nice for Kerry to send out a personal email, thank the subscribers, and give guidance on the end of the magazine. He looked well in the magazine review and maybe he's got time to send out an email.
Thoughts?
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I also renewed for two years just before the disappearance of The Celator. I also received no communication and no refund.
I have always been slightly upset about the money. Generally when you pay for something up front and don't receive it you expect a refund. The fact none of us got one means we all funded some sort of back debt. The amount lost doesn't harm me but I feel more could have been done to explain it.
I never received any communication directly and I don't know any of the other people involved. I, probably like most subscribers, had no special way to get information or a refund.
I understand that there was a personal issue/tragedy involved and I had since written it off in my head.
But I must admit that I am a bit irritated to hear that someone engaged in so little follow-up received the annual award for "outstanding, dedicated service to numismatics".
The way the end of The Celator went down, regardless of the reason behind it, simply did not meet the standard of "outstanding and dedicated service". It has left a bad taste in many a mouth.
SC
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I too renewed for 2 years and was wondering why I never got any new issues after 2 months until I came across it was shut down. I was annoyed by the lack of a refund or just some acknowledgment would have been nice.
Not much can be done now. :-\
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Here is the thing. Everyone these days seems to think digital is the only way to go. I guess I am one of a dying breed. I want print. I know print is expensive, but digital just doesn't cut it for me. I will read things online for sure, but I have never even looked at the digital editions of the few magazines I subscribe to. I never will and I won't read most things that are only digital, with the exception of journal articles I want to read that are available no other way. I will not read digital books except rarely. Every year another magazine bites the dust, it makes me sad. I recall back in pre-internet days there were a lot of quality "zines" out there for special interests. Like the old auction xeroxed sheets and special interest niche zines. I would take those today over anything the Internet offers. I realize that for publishers and sellers, the Internet is easier and cheaper, but I miss the old days. There is some good stuff on the Internet, but it is mostly a cesspool compared to 1999. I predicted in 1997 that capitalism would destroy the Internet and I was right, It is what it is. I also HATE smartphones, so there is that, LOL. I am working on a major project now that involves a book. I will probably lose money, but it isn't going on the Internet. People will pay for a book when they expect something on the Internet to be free or almost nothing. Unless you are one of the tech monopolies that is censoring people, but I am not in that league.
Virgil
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For what it's worth, despite my embracing of most digital media, I still consume my reference books in paper. Things like RIC, BMCRE, etc. are all easier to read in physical format.
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As an academic librarian I’ve been hearing the “print is dead” mantra for 15 years now. It is total BS. I believe that every year more and more books are printed than the previous year, and it is getting cheaper. I just received the new Cambridge Greek lexicon, a two volume hard bound set, for $53! Invariably all my students immediately gravitate to the web and when they finally get to the books, they wish they’d started there!
Internet is great for quick articles, databases, and fun stuff like forums and social media, so I can see why many magazines (and sadly, catalogs) are going online. But for quality books and (most) academic stuff print is unbeatable. I even print all journal PDFs I receive because I just can’t engage deeply on the screen.
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I have a storeroom full of books for sale. Book orders are less than 10% of what they were 10 years ago.
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Hi,
I love having the physical copy of a book. I see a number of auction catalogues that you have listed that I would like Joe but I suspect the shipping will be prohibitive to the UK, sadly.
Regards,
Mauseus
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I have a storeroom full of books for sale. Book orders are less than 10% of what they were 10 years ago.
Perhaps, but the usual attribution references should always be decent sellers as new people enter or advance through the hobby, I suspect. Or maybe I'm wrong - dunno?
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Most people apparently are using online sources and have no need for books.
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Interesting. I've yet to find online versions of Mattingly's RIC 4, BMCRE 5, Muchmov's RD records...
But I do have a online source for Cohen. I use my hard copies anyhow. Guess I'm old fashioned.
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Most people apparently are using online sources and have no need for books.
I suspect many are looking for a quick attribution which is now easily done online.
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Sadly shipping costs are a killer for the used book market. Especially cross-border shipping.
SC
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The trouble with online attribution, and even secondary references, is that errors and misattributions get perpetuated.
Regarded,
Mauseus
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The trouble with online attribution, and even secondary references, is that errors and misattributions get perpetuated.
Regarded,
Mauseus
Completely agree. I un-scientifically would say upwards of 25% of the coins I buy from even reputable dealers are mis-attributed in some way.
Owning and using the primary references is without comparison.
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I do not 100% agree. It's easier to correct mistakes online compare to written references. I just have the RIC in mind, we have to wait 40 years for a revised written edition of any volume... Samething with RPC online, really up to date VS the paper books.
DT
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As an academic librarian I’ve been hearing the “print is dead” mantra for 15 years now.
And this mantra is true. But "print is dead" doesn't mean that there will be absolutely no print. Print is dead just like theater was already dead century ago. Theaters still exist, there are many new performances, new plays etc. But the theater audience is probably less than 1% of the total audience. The rest watch movies, TV, YouTube... I don't want to argue whether it's good or bad. These are just facts.
My private opinion: digital books are far better. They don't need shelves or dusting. They are easy to find and - what is more important - they are searchable. They also don't need transport (which is sometimes more expensive than book). They are available immediately. I just borrowed ebook from my local library although there is past midnight in Poland. The whole borrowing lasted two or three minutes (login, search in catalogue, few mouse clicks).
I have more than 5000 paper books (in communist Poland books were one of few things worth to buy) but if someone could magically turn them into ebooks (except few from my childhood), I would bless him.
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I do not 100% agree. It's easier to correct mistakes online compare to written references.
For me it is obvious that all references, encyclopedias, dictionaries etc. should be digitalized and available online.
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I do not 100% agree. It's easier to correct mistakes online compare to written references.
For me it is obvious that all references, encyclopedias, dictionaries etc. should be digitalized and available online.
Except that they are not. Most of the RIC books are not online. See for the British museum reference books. Certainly not for the third century coins I collect.
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The online resources that I’ve discovered via Forum/Numiswiki have been invaluable, especially when I was first starting out, and whenever I am able I add to them and correct broken links if I find them and can do so. One of the goals with my Numiswiki Sasanian References 2 page was to add a URL for each work cited that was accessible online. I periodically test those links and fix broken ones when I can. Online sources can be so convenient, easy to use, portable (have laptop/smart phone will travel) and searchability (if available) is a great tool. I agree 100% with Lech’s statement about the digitization of references, encyclopedias, dictionaries, etc. I am also a heavy user of JSTOR, and when I am on the UW Madison’s WiFi I have full, institutional access, which allows me to download PDFs. What do I do with them after downloading? I print them!!
I love the printed word, print/copy journal articles whenever I can, and also buy many books (more than I should), even books that I can easily access online (e.g. BDC Thessaly I and II, Traité, etc.). I guess that I prefer to use hard copies, but they do come with their “price” (as Lech stated: storage, dusting, shipping, boxes and boxes and boxes of them when moving).
Unfortunately online sources can sometimes be susceptible to disappearance. Just look at what happened to the Lorber/Shahar Silver Facing Head Coins of Larissa website: obsolete technology compounded by (understandably) the too daunting task of rebuilding the site from scratch. Of course, however, books can also be destroyed in many different ways.
Nothing wrong with the best of both worlds: digitization and the printed word. I love the convenience (and as Dominic T stated the ease of making corrections to online sources) of the former, but for the aesthetic and tactile experience nothing beats the latter. If I am sitting in my chair early in the morning or late at night, it is a book in my hand and not a device in my lap. But, that’s just my personal preference and nothing more.
Tracy
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As an academic librarian I’ve been hearing the “print is dead” mantra for 15 years now.
And this mantra is true. But "print is dead" doesn't mean that there will be absolutely no print. Print is dead just like theater was already dead century ago. Theaters still exist, there are many new performances, new plays etc. But the theater audience is probably less than 1% of the total audience. The rest watch movies, TV, YouTube... I don't want to argue whether it's good or bad. These are just facts.
My private opinion: digital books are far better. They don't need shelves or dusting. They are easy to find and - what is more important - they are searchable. They also don't need transport (which is sometimes more expensive than book). They are available immediately. I just borrowed ebook from my local library although there is past midnight in Poland. The whole borrowing lasted two or three minutes (login, search in catalogue, few mouse clicks).
I have more than 5000 paper books (in communist Poland books were one of few things worth to buy) but if someone could magically turn them into ebooks (except few from my childhood), I would bless him.
Well the data of newly published works in print and corresponding sales tells a different story (maybe not for Joe’s sales but the general publishing industry, academic or otherwise).
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What do I do with them after downloading? I print them!!
I am not a principled environmentalist but your habit is certainly not good for the planet. :-[
Unfortunately online sources can sometimes be susceptible to disappearance.
Yes, I agree, especially sources made by hobbyists, private persons, and without institutional support. The solution is to make such sources copy-friendly: easy to download and to use offline.
For example, my "Not in RIC" is nearly 2GB big (~25,000 files) but it's structure is extremely simple. You just need to copy all the files, put them into one directory and click index.html. That's all. So I strongly suggest to make such personal copy and to update it monthly or quarterly. There are many free applications which can do it automatically. Pendrive 2-4GB (obsolete size) costs in Poland $2-3, in USA perhaps cheaper. I immodestly think that my page is worth two bucks.
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Well the data of newly published works in print and corresponding sales tells a different story (maybe not for Joe’s sales but the general publishing industry, academic or otherwise).
Do you really believe that amount of printed books grows faster than amount of ebooks?
And there is also a grey sphere of reading which grows rapidly. For example: academic library buys an academic book, student borrows it and makes scans, then sends scans to friends. If one of them will upload these scans/pdf to Internet there will be soon a thousands of new readers of such ebook. All from one printed book.
Probably in XV century, when Gutenberg started, some people also said that there are more manuscripts than ever. Which was also true at that time. But what counts is the dynamics of processes.
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Maybe cross border is a problem, but media mail in the US is a dream. It is literally the only postage that is affordable these days. As long as you are willing to wait (a few days) and don't expect two day delivery. I never got the instant gratification delivery thing. I can always wait. Of course I am old enough to remember when packages from overseas came via ship.
Virgil
Sadly shipping costs are a killer for the used book market. Especially cross-border shipping.
SC
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Yes, it is cross-border that is the problem. A scam by USPS and others with "products" like the "international book box".
Someone in upstate New York will pay four-five times as much to send a book to me - a three hour drive away - than they will pay to send the same book to California.
SC
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Yes, it is cross-border that is the problem. A scam by USPS and others with "products" like the "international book box".
Someone in upstate New York will pay four-five times as much to send a book to me - a three hour drive away - than they will pay to send the same book to California.
SC
I can't wait for the border to reopen so I can start using my NY state Mail box again. Like Shawn, I live maybe 40 minutes from the border towns.
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Well the data of newly published works in print and corresponding sales tells a different story (maybe not for Joe’s sales but the general publishing industry, academic or otherwise).
Do you really believe that amount of printed books grows faster than amount of ebooks?
And there is also a grey sphere of reading which grows rapidly. For example: academic library buys an academic book, student borrows it and makes scans, then sends scans to friends. If one of them will upload these scans/pdf to Internet there will be soon a thousands of new readers of such ebook. All from one printed book.
Probably in XV century, when Gutenberg started, some people also said that there are more manuscripts than ever. Which was also true at that time. But what counts is the dynamics of processes.
I wouldn’t say print is growing faster because eBooks are a newer technology, but it is still growing and customers seem to prefer it. When I first started out all the major book dealers were all pushing eBooks and it was a bit of a flop. Your reasons for preferring digital are good—it is convenient and searchable, but what the market has seen is that customers want the physical thing, not a digital copy that, in many cases, is as expensive and occasionally more expensive. Some dealers now just bundle them. Others are trying a lease program which is already failing miserably. The ultimate problem is that publishers don’t want to lose money and customers expect a lower price. When prices of eBooks drop substantially we’ll perhaps see the end, but I don’t expect it.
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The ultimate problem is that publishers don’t want to lose money and customers expect a lower price.
Maybe I am completely wrong but I imagine that nowadays academic publishers think that way:
There are, let's say, four thousand academic and large public libraries in the world. If almost every library buys only one copy, we can sell about two or three thousand copies, which at a fairly high price (mostly paid by libraries with tax money) will be profitable. So it will be safer to print five not-so-good but still academic books in edition of 2000 copies each than one good book in edition of 10 000 copies with the hope that students and other private persons will also buy it.
And then academic librarian receives a new catalogue of books in print and says: Wow! There were 100 new books ten years ago and now there are 500. Who said that print is dead?!
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My take: producing, warehousing, and distributing a paper book is expensive. The book is written in MS word, and making it a pdf is basically free.
Cost savings to not have to sell me something phisical should be passed to the consumer. But they are not. E-books generally cost about the same as print.
For the same price, or even for a premium, I would rather own something more durable than my hard drive's 1's and 0's.
The publishers are taking in unfair profit on e-books, in my opinion. I am unwilling to contribute to this system unless there is a massive cost savings to doing so.
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E-books generally cost about the same as print.
The same was in Poland years ago but now situation changes. Probably mostly because of ebooks pirates. Now price of ebook is nearly always significantly lower than of printed book. Sometimes 50% lower, sometimes even more. There are also many promotional sales and invaluable webpage which informs where at the moment the price is lowest. At that page you can also establish your own limits. For example the regular price is 30 zlotys but you ask for notifying when the price drops under 20 zlotys. All of that is perfectly legal and I bought many ebooks that way. Of course, this only applies to Polish publishers.
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A quick search reveals that, at least in the US, print outsells eBooks by an enormous margin, so it is not just delusional academic librarians: 25 billion dollars versus 191 million dollars.
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This is a big surprise for me because I knew slightly different data.
https://about.ebooks.com/ebook-industry-news-feed/
Could you share your source, please?
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https://www.statista.com/topics/1177/book-market/
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That was from a quick search but it is consistent with other formal studies I’ve read and my knowledge of the industry.
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It also is consistent with my brief read of your link—which says eBooks are only 21% of the market. Print is hardly dead by those numbers.
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I like the dual-format products, which are popular in the role-playing game world.
A hard copy comes with a free key-code to download a PDF. That way you get the proper physical book, but you also have a digital copy which means you can easily carry around a heap of books on your laptop and you can do things like key-word searches.
SC
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eBooks are only 21% of the market.
21% of sold books. But eBooks are easily copied and shared. We may safely assume that 1 sold ebook = 10 existing copies (probably rather 100 or 1000). We should also add PDF files made from scans of printed books. And this shapes the reading habits of the young generation.
https://www.statista.com/statistics/688411/book-piracy-sites/
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It depends on the format of the eBook, really. At libraries (and things like kindle) it is very closely controlled, so if you buy single access that is all you get, and must pay substantially more for universal access. I have no doubt downloadable PDF books are pirated but how much is tough to determine.
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At libraries (and things like kindle) it is very closely controlled
I think it is an illusion of control. I agree with opinion from statista.com I linked earlier: "Sadly though, e-book piracy is almost impossible to stop".
I just checked one of the well-known pirate sites with easy free access (no credit cards scams, no registration etc.). They have at the moment 8,052,673 books and 80,759,558 articles (mostly in English). Probably all students in USA are aware of this.
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I have never shared an ebook or even software, although piracy is an issue, just not that big of one as publishers want us to believe. That is me and I did use Napster back in the day, so I am not pristine. The only ebooks I will read are mass market novels. I cannot imagine using a digital textbook. I would get nothing out of one and have actually given it a go. The idea they are searchable is ludicrous. Sure they are, then you never find that page again. Bookmarks, notes, and highlighting just are useless in ebooks. Any book that is important to me has to be print. That includes coin reference books. I cannot imagine trying to use a digital book to identify a coin unless I already know exactly what I am looking for. Ebooks are handy for travel, I will give them that. And I will read cheap novels on a reader, but that is it. Screens are also harder on the eyes. And the pricing is so ridiculous that in some cases a Kindle book is higher priced than the print version. And, either way, authors are getting screwed. Speaking of textbooks, that industry has been a scam for decades now, print or otherwise.
Virgil
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Hello All,
For what's it worth, as a member of ANA I provided feedback to them on how Kerry Wetterstrom handled the closing of the Celator magazine and subscribers who were never notified or compensated. ANA said they had no knowledge of any complaints about Mr. Wetterstrom. At least they know now.
Thank you.
Kevin