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FORVM`s Classical Numismatics Discussion Board  |  Numismatic and History Discussions  |  History and Archeology (Moderator: David Atherton)  |  Topic: Investigators may have discovered earliest evidence of Christian iconography 0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic. « previous next »
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Author Topic: Investigators may have discovered earliest evidence of Christian iconography  (Read 1909 times)
SPQR Matt
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« on: February 28, 2012, 06:02:59 pm »

Here's an article some might find interesting:

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/sideshow/investigators-may-discovered-earliest-evidence-christian-iconography-jerusalem-231736336.html
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« Reply #1 on: February 29, 2012, 11:15:33 am »

Neat article.  I find it interesting that most discoveries related to biblical themes generate the most conflict and controversy, especially in dealing with textual criticism.
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« Reply #2 on: March 01, 2012, 03:38:33 pm »

There's money in making outrageous claims about Christian origins, that's part of it. So far there's no hard evidence to connect any of this stuff to Jesus' family or the church.
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David Atherton
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« Reply #3 on: March 01, 2012, 05:04:24 pm »

There's money in making outrageous claims about Christian origins, that's part of it. So far there's no hard evidence to connect any of this stuff to Jesus' family or the church.

Tabor has a book that just came out, which explains why this is in the "news". Pseudoarchaeology at its worst - leave your critical thinking at the door.
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« Reply #4 on: March 02, 2012, 07:11:00 am »

Very true.  The ossuary "find" seemed designed for that very purpose.  These guys can be worse than quacks.
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« Reply #5 on: March 02, 2012, 04:11:12 pm »

Here's a good post from Mark Goodacre, debunking one of the claims being made. The fish scratched on one of the ossuaries is being connected to the Jonah story - there isn't any real evidence to support this - and they're claiming that Jonah was linked to the resurrection at a very early time. To support this, they're quoting 'Q', a reconstructed (nobody's ever found a copy, and neither Goodacre nor I believe it ever existed) source used by Matthew and Luke. The idea is an old one,  offering one possible explanation of the fact that Luke and Matthew, while both adapted and expanded on Mark, also contain shared material which isn't in Mark. Unfortunately the Jonah idea isn't in Q (Goodacre is a top expert on the relationship between the Gospels), and originated with Matthew, which seems to have been writted about the 80's AD. So there is in fact no evidence that it goes back anywhere near the date they're claiming for the tomb!

http://ntweblog.blogspot.com/2012/03/talpiot-tomb-jonah-and-q.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+MarkGoodacresNTBlog+%28Mark+Goodacre%27s+NT+Blog%29&utm_content=Google+Reader
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« Reply #6 on: March 06, 2012, 04:37:50 pm »

There's a comprehensive debunking here: http://asorblog.org/?p=1642
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Robert Brenchley

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« Reply #7 on: March 06, 2012, 05:59:30 pm »

Thank you Robert for both of the above links. It's great to read unbiased analysis of the evidence.
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« Reply #8 on: March 06, 2012, 07:56:04 pm »

There's a comprehensive debunking here: http://asorblog.org/?p=1642

Just by reading the posts here I sensed the presence of Simcha Jacobovici.  This is exactly something he would do.  Pseudo-archaeological finds with no real supporting evidence. 

He is not an archaeologist, he is a television writer.  Most of his historical claims are written with entertainment in mind, not academics, and cannot be taken as anything but entertainment.
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« Reply #9 on: March 07, 2012, 02:43:50 pm »

That's about the size of it; he's got a terrible reputation. It now appears that the 'fish' image was photoshopped. http://robertcargill.com/2012/03/05/if-the-evidence-doesnt-fit-photoshop-it/
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« Reply #10 on: March 07, 2012, 05:35:37 pm »

They remind me of this guy:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Erich_von_D%C3%A4niken

mz
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David Atherton
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« Reply #11 on: March 07, 2012, 06:24:00 pm »

That's about the size of it; he's got a terrible reputation. It now appears that the 'fish' image was photoshopped. http://robertcargill.com/2012/03/05/if-the-evidence-doesnt-fit-photoshop-it/

Unsurprising that they shoehorn the evidence to fit their conclusions. One wonders if this kind of dishonesty is intentional or from ignorance.
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« Reply #12 on: March 08, 2012, 03:24:11 pm »

I think they know exactly what they're doing.
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FORVM`s Classical Numismatics Discussion Board  |  Numismatic and History Discussions  |  History and Archeology (Moderator: David Atherton)  |  Topic: Investigators may have discovered earliest evidence of Christian iconography « previous next »
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