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benito
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« on: June 28, 2011, 01:53:45 am »

Are there any coins commemorating the " founding " of Colonia Lucia Annia Commodiana ?
Or with that legend ?
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*Alex
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« Reply #1 on: June 28, 2011, 09:30:31 am »

Yes, RIC III : 560 (Sestertius) and RIC III : 570 (As). According to RIC, not ultra rare, both being rated as R2.

Alex.
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benito
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« Reply #2 on: June 28, 2011, 09:43:57 am »

Thanks. Right now I don't have my RIC III. But managed to see both   in Cohen.
If my information is correct Rome was then founded at least twice. One by Romulus ,the other by Commodus ( with a new name).
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*Alex
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« Reply #3 on: June 28, 2011, 11:28:16 am »

If my information is correct Rome was then founded at least twice. One by Romulus ,the other by Commodus ( with a new name).

Depends how you look at it I suppose. In my mind, Rome was only founded once. Was Commodus' intention the refounding of Rome, or the founding of a "new" city designed to supplant it? I do not know the workings of the mind of a madman.  Grin

There was, too, if you want to count it, a kind of refoundation ritual which took place at various times throughout the Roman period when the pomerium of the city was increased. But the Roman's didn't count each of those as the founding of Rome, and neither do I.  Grin

Alex.
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curtislclay
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« Reply #4 on: June 28, 2011, 12:00:12 pm »

As Chantraine proposed in 1971, COL LAN COMM on Commodus' coins of 190 should be read  "Lanuvium, the Commodan Colony", apparently commemorating Commodus' promotion of his birthplace Lanuvium to colonial status, not "(Rome), the Lucian Antoninian Commodan Colony", as traditionally interpreted. For how could Commodus possibly have renamed Rome "Lucian" at a time when he was still using the praenomen Marcus not Lucius? See the As below, with obverse legend beginning M(arcus); it was only in the course of the following year, 191, that Commodus returned to the praenomen Lucius that he had used before his father's death!

Commodus did refound Rome in 192, as Dio Cassius attests, and a golden statue of the emperor as Hercules and founder, plowing with a team of bull and cow, was erected, which is also depicted on rare coins and medallions of that year: see example below, with inscription "To the Roman Hercules, the Founder".

In fact it was comparatively common during the Roman empire for cities to be refounded, sometimes also adopting a new era, in honor of an emperor who could be regarded as the city's savior. Promoting a Greek city to colonial status also involved a refounding ceremony; hence the plowing type that is so common on colonial coins.

However, this doesn't mean that Hadrian founded Aelia Capitolina twice, the case Benito apparently has in mind. That possibility certainly cannot be excluded, but it cannot be accepted as probable either, in the absence  of reliable evidence establishing Jerusalem's status immediately before, during, and after the Second Revolt.
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Curtis Clay
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« Reply #5 on: June 28, 2011, 12:14:53 pm »

Thank you Curtis.
I won't bother updating the rubbish I wrote, I will leave it as a reminder to me that there has been a great increase in knowledge since the 19th century and that this old dog is still willing to try and learn new tricks. Grin

Regards,

Alex.
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Andrew McCabe
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« Reply #6 on: June 28, 2011, 01:08:25 pm »

Thank you Curtis.
I won't bother updating the rubbish I wrote, I will leave it as a reminder to me that there has been a great increase in knowledge since the 19th century and that this old dog is still willing to try and learn new tricks. Grin

Regards,

Alex.

There is also a great deal of lost wisdom since the 19th century. Curtis, who likes antiquarian sources even more than I do, knows this better than most.

I do on a fairly regular basis check back our received wisdom against older sources. It's amusing to find either (a) some uninformed guess made about 1541 still being carried as the truth of (b) the other extreme, some too-clever but not-wise-enough 20th century writer of "truth" arbitrarily altering the received wisdom of centuries which promptly gets forgotten. Such differences are regularly triggered when I note something said in "Roman Silver Coins 1" (i.e. Babelon) that differs from Crawford (must be hundreds of such differences) and think "has anyone thought about this since 1632 or whenever?
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