Classical Numismatics Discussion Board
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?
November 01, 2014, 07:56:50 am
Search Calendar Login Register  

Recent Additions to Forum's Shop


FORVM`s Classical Numismatics Discussion Board  |  Numismatic and History Discussions  |  Roman Coins (Moderator: Severus_Alexander)  |  Topic: The votive Vrbs Roma 0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic. « previous next »
Pages: [1] Go Down Print
Author Topic: The votive Vrbs Roma  (Read 1126 times)
antvwala
Guest
« on: June 13, 2010, 05:48:40 am »

The votive Vrbs Roma

Between 347 and 348, the anverese of Vrbs Roma was combined with reverse VOT XX XXX MVLT.  This issue of thid small votive coins (14-16 mm in diameter) took place only by the mints of Heraclea and Nicomedia.
For Heraclea, there were two issues involving two Officinae (A and B: Ric 49 and 56 respectively, identified by a dot in front of the initials of the mint). Instead for Nicomedia there was only one issue, rare although has been performed by five workshops (A, B, Δ, H, Θ).
Due to the small size of the module, generally less than that of the issue, often the exergue is barely visible. Therefore the specimens where is secure identification of mint and officina, are to be considered quite rare. (I haven't sure samples of Nicomedia).
Not infrequently, illegible or unclear Vrbs Roma votives of Heraclea proposals by sellers, are attributing to mint of Nicomedia.

In parallel, there was also the issue votive with Constantinopolis in anverse, emitted from Heraclea and Cyzicus.

If you have other images, in addition to those I posted below, post them too!  Smiley   Thank you


Antvwala
Logged
Matthew W2
Consul
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 145


« Reply #1 on: June 14, 2010, 07:03:06 pm »

Hi Antwala,

Thanks for starting this thread, I've been curious about these for awhile. Smiley

I have four or five (at least two with legible mintmarks). I will try to get pictures of them up soon!
Logged
antvwala
Guest
« Reply #2 on: June 15, 2010, 08:09:24 am »

Thank Matthew!
At moment, I don't know sample of Nicomedia with readable exergue!

Antvwala
Logged
Matthew W2
Consul
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 145


« Reply #3 on: June 20, 2010, 12:17:58 am »

These are my first attempts at coin photography, so hopefully they're not too horrible looking! (Well, not all the coins are beautiful anyway....)

The mintmarks are not as legible as I remembered, and I think based on what you posted above that they are all from Heraclea. One has a bungled mintmark, but does not otherwise seem imitative to my eyes, but I'd appreciate any further opinions on it - or on any of them!

Coin #1: (dot?)SM??



Coin #2:  :dot:SMH?



Coin #3: (illegible; and the picture may a little out of focus on the obverse)



Coin #4: SMHB (S is bungled)



Coin #5: ???B (I would guess SMH for the first three letters, but they are even harder to see than the final B, which is a bit clearer in person)



The coins have also been added to my gallery: http://www.forumancientcoins.com/gallery/index.php?cat=25239
Logged
antvwala
Guest
« Reply #4 on: June 20, 2010, 04:43:46 am »

Thank you very much, Matthew!

First coin is Heraclea, 2th emission
2th coin is Heraclea, 2th emission
3th coin don't know (Nicomedia?)
4th coin Heraclea, 2th emission, dot SMHA
5th coin dont' know (Nicomedia?)

Style of bust is same in first, 2th and 4th coin; it appears to me different (less elegant!) in 3th and 5th coin. Also wreath appears different in 3th and 5th coin (see figure).

Do you think about this possible difference between Heraclea and Nicomedia mint?
Bust of Heraclea is better elegant that Nicomedia?


Antvwala


Logged
antvwala
Guest
« Reply #5 on: June 23, 2010, 06:13:24 pm »

5th coin is Heraclea Oficina B: I don't understand if it is Ric 49 or 56.

I don't know sure coins of Nicomedia (with readeble exergus).

Antvwala
Logged
Matthew W2
Consul
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 145


« Reply #6 on: June 24, 2010, 08:42:37 pm »

5th coin is Heraclea Oficina B: I don't understand if it is Ric 49 or 56.

I don't know sure coins of Nicomedia (with readeble exergus).

Antvwala


Thanks for the information! To me, the busts of 1, 2, 4, and 5 (despite the dirt) all look similar.

I'm not sure I see the pattern in the wreaths that you refer to - it looks like there are three different types. But it is hard to see because some of the coins are so worn.

The tops of the wreaths on 2 and 5 are definitely different, but 1, 3, and 4 almost seem to be a third type. Or maybe they are similar to the wreath of coin 5, but more worn? The oval on the wreath for coin 5 seems bigger than on 1, 3, and 4 though, and has a star inside the oval?

Logged
antvwala
Guest
« Reply #7 on: June 25, 2010, 03:39:11 am »

Your photographs are excellent. Unfortunately, this money rarely exergue is readable in a certain and, moreover, often the difference between N and H is uncertain ...
I wonder if there really is an issue of Nicomedia....

My hypothesis that with analysis of the oval of wreath it's possible to separate types of Nicomedia those Heraclea, is totally wrong, as I have found by analyzing other votive coins of these two mints...

Antvwala
Logged
antvwala
Guest
« Reply #8 on: June 28, 2010, 12:20:22 am »

Hello!
These are all votive coins Vrbs Roma with  illegible exergue.
According to you, some of them might be of Nicomedia (based on the style of bust or legend)?
A friend of the Italian section of the FAC, he thinks that the exergue No 11 maybe SMNA: what do you think?
Thanks.
Antvwala
Logged
antvwala
Guest
« Reply #9 on: June 28, 2010, 08:41:02 am »

Hello!
The coin 07 in previous image is of Nicomedia, Officina  Greek_Theta_2 (finally I know a coin of NicomediaSmiley )
Now I have keeped up the image with other 3 coins.
I am sure that you recognize and read some of these exergus!  Smiley

Antvwala
Logged
Matthew W2
Consul
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 145


« Reply #10 on: June 28, 2010, 07:13:43 pm »

Hello!
The coin 07 in previous image is of Nicomedia, Officina  Greek_Theta_2 (finally I know a coin of NicomediaSmiley )
Now I have keeped up the image with other 3 coins.
I am sure that you recognize and read some of these exergus!  Smiley

Antvwala


Great! And I am impressed that you're able to recognize anything about coin 07! What details led to you think it was Nicomedia  Greek_Theta_2?

For coin 11, Nicomedia A may actually be right... I looked at the coin upside down in different lighting, and the third letter does look a bit more like an N than an H from that angle, and the fourth letter could be an A. I guess I would be a bit surprised based on the style of the portrait, but it could be right.

I'll see if I can get a better photo that captures it. Maybe this makes two coins of Nicomedia Smiley

(I only see one image with 13 coins from your last two posts - do the coins have the same numbers in the two images you refer to? I assume so, but just want to check).


Logged
antvwala
Guest
« Reply #11 on: June 29, 2010, 06:34:30 am »

Hello!
The previous coin No 07 (now been replaced by another) presented a theta (the only point visible) at end of exergus and this is only possible for Nicomedia.

Even an Italian friend in the coin No 11 sees an N rather than H.  Smiley

Antvwala
Logged
antvwala
Guest
« Reply #12 on: June 29, 2010, 06:38:19 am »

These are all votive VrbsRoma  for which I have an image:
Logged
Matthew W2
Consul
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 145


« Reply #13 on: July 02, 2010, 10:07:53 pm »

Here are a few different views of the mintmark for coin #11:




I think the bottom left shows the third letter to be an N most clearly. The top left maybe does show the last letter to be an A, but it is harder to see.

Also, the dot to the left of SM looks odd to me, less like a dot and more like an S. What do you think about that?

Logged
antvwala
Guest
« Reply #14 on: July 03, 2010, 03:53:26 am »

It seems to me to read SMNA!
In Ric is writed the existence of tree Officinae: Ric Nicomedia 53: SMNB  -  SMN Greek_Delta   -  SMN Greek_Theta  But I think that it is possible other Officinae...  Smiley

Antvwala
 
Logged
Pages: [1] Go Up Print 
FORVM`s Classical Numismatics Discussion Board  |  Numismatic and History Discussions  |  Roman Coins (Moderator: Severus_Alexander)  |  Topic: The votive Vrbs Roma « previous next »
Jump to:  

Recent Price Reductions in Forum's Shop


Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.20 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
Page created in 2.487 seconds with 54 queries.