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Author Topic: Question about Agrippa's Pantheon  (Read 3021 times)

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Offline Jay GT4

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Question about Agrippa's Pantheon
« on: March 31, 2008, 10:51:37 pm »
We all know that Marcus Agrippa built the first Pantheon that was eventually burned and that Hadrian rebuilt it.  My question is....Did the original Pantheon have the domed ceiling?  I always thought it did not, but while reading a book on Germanicus (Blood of the Caesars) the author stated that Agrippa's Pantheon had a domed roof.  If that is the case then the real genius is the architect of Agrippas building!  Are there any historical records that state that Agrippa's Pantheon was indeed domed?

Offline slokind

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Re: Question about Agrippa's Pantheon
« Reply #1 on: April 01, 2008, 12:12:10 am »
I have never read a serious study of the Pantheon, from Rivoira to MacDonald, that thought that Agrippa's Pantheon was domed.  Not only undocumented but most unlikely.  Hadrian kept the conventional temple front (but the letters that state that it's Agrippa's are Hadrian's letters), but the cosmic symbol of the perfect 120 square feet (Roman) of the spherical interior space (the sphere being tangent to the floor) and the post-Domitianic engineering to build it are Hadrianic.  The architectural engineer who did such brilliant work was pretty surely Apollodorus of Damascus (also at work in Trajan's Forum and the Mercati), who continued to work with Hadrian.  The idea of building a Pantheon in that design is probably Hadrian's own.  Roman brick making was franchised and supervised; the licensed brickmakers had to put stamps on their bricks, since the quality of bricks and mortar was so extremely important.  The stamped bricks, not only in the circular part of the Pantheon but in the brick parts of the porch, are Hadrianic, datable about AD 120.  Hadrian's romantic feelings for tradition and for men whose legacy he admired, such as Agrippa, account for his pietas made manifest in this (IMO--and with all respect to Hagia Sophia) most awesome and admirable of all ancient buildings; at least, its interior space is the most awe inspiring.
Pat L.
P.S. Those are excellent photographs.

Pat L.

Offline Jay GT4

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Re: Question about Agrippa's Pantheon
« Reply #2 on: April 01, 2008, 12:19:58 am »
Pat that is exactly what I thought!  It actually makes me wonder about this author credibility to make such a statement!  (But I am thoroughly enjoying his book!)  :laugh:

I agree, it is one of the most beautiful buildings I have ever been in, pictures simply do not do it justice.  Hopefully I'll be back there this fall.

A great documentary by the History channel "Rome: Engineering an Empire" spends quite a bit of time on the Pantheon and Apollodorus and the techniques employed.  I highly recommend it.

Thanks for the compliment.  I have hundreds of photos!

Offline wandigeaux (1940 - 2010)

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Re: Question about Agrippa's Pantheon
« Reply #3 on: April 01, 2008, 01:52:13 am »
I have no memory of where I saw this, but the area where the inscription on the pediment of the building was planned and the individual letters were arranged on the ground has been found in Rome.  As I recall, much evidence of trial and error in the layout of the letters was evident.  I mention this in case it will jog the memory of someone else who can comment.  Cheers, George Spradling
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Offline David Atherton

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Re: Question about Agrippa's Pantheon
« Reply #4 on: April 03, 2008, 08:38:09 am »
The author might have read that Agrippa's Pantheon was domed in Cassius Dio:  Also he completed the building called the Pantheon. It has this name, perhaps because it received among the images which decorated it the statues of many gods, including Mars and Venus; but my own opinion of the name is that, because of its vaulted roof, it resembles the heavens. (53.27.2), clearly Dio was in error.

The original building was destroyed in the fire of 80 AD during Titus' reign. It was rebuilt by Domitian... later it was struck by lighting and burned down again in the time of Trajan. Hadrian seems to have completely rebuilt the Pantheon from scratch.

Offline LordBest

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Re: Question about Agrippa's Pantheon
« Reply #5 on: April 03, 2008, 08:57:55 am »
Vaulted does not necessarily mean domed, does it? It could be a misinterpretation based on that passage in Dio, rather than an error by Dio.
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Offline David Atherton

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Re: Question about Agrippa's Pantheon
« Reply #6 on: April 03, 2008, 09:05:13 am »
Vaulted does not necessarily mean domed, does it? It could be a misinterpretation based on that passage in Dio, rather than an error by Dio.
                                                                         LordBest. 8)

Very true, but I was going by L. Richardson's A New Topographical Dictionary of Ancient
Rome
reading of the passage in which he uses the word 'dome'. Perhaps it is up to the individual interpretation...but clearly anyone wanting to find evidence that the earlier building was domed needs to use Dio's passage as evidence.

Offline Steve Minnoch

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Re: Question about Agrippa's Pantheon
« Reply #7 on: April 03, 2008, 09:07:44 am »
Regardless of what the word or words translated as "vaulted" mean, what other architectural device other than a dome would "resemble the heavens"?

Steve

Offline David Atherton

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Re: Question about Agrippa's Pantheon
« Reply #8 on: April 03, 2008, 09:19:07 am »
It is very likely Dio had no historical knowledge of the building. Agrippa's Pantheon had a T-shaped plan, much like the Temple of Concordia...the later building built by Hadrian has no architectural connection to this at all.

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Re: Question about Agrippa's Pantheon
« Reply #9 on: April 03, 2008, 09:23:08 am »
Quote from: Titus Pullo on April 01, 2008, 12:19:58 am
Pat that is exactly what I thought!  It actually makes me wonder about this author credibility to make such a statement!  (But I am thoroughly enjoying his book!)  :laugh:

I agree, it is one of the most beautiful buildings I have ever been in, pictures simply do not do it justice.  Hopefully I'll be back there this fall.

A great documentary by the History channel "Rome: Engineering an Empire" spends quite a bit of time on the Pantheon and Apollodorus and the techniques employed.  I highly recommend it.

Thanks for the compliment.  I have hundreds of photos!

"Rome: Engineerng an Empire" was indeed a very nice program. They have copies availible for purchase on History Channel . com.  Just thought I would mention that.

Offline LordBest

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Re: Question about Agrippa's Pantheon
« Reply #10 on: April 03, 2008, 09:45:41 am »
Regardless of what the word or words translated as "vaulted" mean, what other architectural device other than a dome would "resemble the heavens"?

Steve
'Resemble the heavens' could be a reference to the decoration not architectural details for all we know. It really is a moot point until someone with Dio in the original Latin can check the actual wording.
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Offline Robert_Brenchley

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Re: Question about Agrippa's Pantheon
« Reply #11 on: April 03, 2008, 04:29:38 pm »
In English, 'vaulted' just means that it has an arched stone roof; it doesn't necessarily imply a dome at all. The important thing with any translation, though, is the meaning of the original.
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Offline slokind

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Re: Question about Agrippa's Pantheon
« Reply #12 on: April 03, 2008, 04:31:25 pm »
Dio is in Greek.  If no one beats me to it, I'll check later.  P.L.

Offline Jay GT4

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Re: Question about Agrippa's Pantheon
« Reply #13 on: April 03, 2008, 06:29:33 pm »
I have Dio here but I don't know where to begin to look for this passage!

Offline slokind

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Re: Question about Agrippa's Pantheon
« Reply #14 on: April 04, 2008, 12:42:57 am »
I tried the short-cut of looking in Pollitt's sources book The Art of Rome, c. 753 B.C.-337 A/D. and found only the anecdotes from LXIX. 4. 1-5.  I'm going to have to look further.  P.L.

 

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