Histiaia tetrobol fakes??

[helcaraxe]

Hello out there, hunters of the faked coins! 

I've got three coins, which I am not sure whether are fakes or not.

I came across them on a coin show in Germany and bought them from a dealer which I had no reason to mistrust. I had no clue of this fake Histiaia coin hoard at the time of the purchase:
https://www.forumancientcoins.com/fakes/displayimage.php?album=10&pos=239
https://www.forumancientcoins.com/fakes/displayimage.php?album=10&pos=240
https://www.forumancientcoins.com/fakes/displayimage.php?album=10&pos=241

But maybe the dealer has been decieved too. The coins were from a lot which looked as if they came fresh vom the earth.

They look struck and from different dies (a bit different though from the ones shown in the FORUM fake reports).

So, what do you think? Are they fakes too?

Thanx a lot in advance!

Semper pax,
helcaraxe.

Now here are the coins:

[helcaraxe]

and the last....

[slokind]

Did you check the BCD collection?  It's a special Lanz (as I recall) catalogue including a couple of dozen of these.  Ones like those your bought are not the most common fake ones, but I've never studied them.  I'll try to find yours if no one who knows them better comes forward.  It's the same cdtalogue that has Thessaly and Boeotia in it.  If not Lanz, it's the CNG one.   Pat L.
P.S. It's Lanz Auktion 111, Münzen von Euboia: Sammlung BCD.  Nov. 2002.  Histiaia starts on p. 71.  As you see, I was wrong; this Lanz catalog is on Euboia alone.
The dies for the tetrobols seem innumerable, though of course all die quantities are finite, so look for style and technique rather than a match.  The date range is considerable, and the technical level is variable.  These are very good to hone your skills on.
P.L.

[bpmurphy]

All fakes.

See other thread on Forum somewhere.

Barry Murphy

[helcaraxe]

Hello Pat, hello bpmyrphy!

Thanks a lot for your replys!

@bpmurphy: there are a lot of threads at forum, but you probably meant this one:
https://www.forumancientcoins.com/board/index.php?topic=36409.0

It looks as if I've acquired my first examples for the black cabinet finally...

This example shows clearly that knowledge is the best friend if it comes to detect fakes. This knowledge I had not when buying this coins. My ones look indeed very different in style compared to originial ones:

http://www.coinarchives.com/a/lotviewer.php?LotID=84189&AucID=90&Lot=551

And my are underweight, too (1.75 to 1.77 grams), which I should have noticed....

Thanx again!

Semper pax
helcaraxe

[bpmurphy]

helcaraxe,

This thread has the link to the photo composite of the fakes:

http://ancients.info/forums/showthread.php?t=877

Barry

[Rupert]

Please pardon me for barging in here with my Histiaia. Ever since the discussion about all these Histiaia fakes has come up, I'm not so comfortable about my specimen anymore. I never had had any doubts about it before, but these fakes are damn good in my opinion.

Is this one real? I didn't find it in the composite image of the fake coins, but this doesn't mean much, since I find them really hard to compare - also because mostly the dies aren't completely on the flan. My coin is of rather dark, oxydized silver, and it's grossly underweight at just 12 mm across and 0.91 g (!). I bought it in 2001.

Thanks in advance,

Rupert

[Joe Sermarini]

Barry reports that all the examples with wild hair sticking up are fake.  Yours is one of those.

[helcaraxe]

@barry: Thanx for the link, I had found it already. Great job!

@rupert:

Sorry, mate, it looks as if we are fellows in misery! :-(

Semper pax,
helcaraxe

[areich]

What confuses me is that even I regularly see 'wild hair' types at major European auction houses
and I don't really follow those auctions all that much. 

Andreas

[helcaraxe]

I haven't notices that. Can you give an example?

Semper pax
helcaraxe.

[areich]

These for example:






Unsold

These are older, I found them searching for the other ones:





It really isn't that easy and only those with the 'wildest hair' (3 and 5 for me) are easily recognizable.
Based on that rule of thumb though I wouldn't have bid on the others either though I don't really think they are fake.
In fact I'll never buy one of those, just like those 'Black Sea hoard' coins.

Andreas

[helcaraxe]

Well, number three and five are clearly from the same fake hoard. The other - I don't know. I am not sure either.

It is really a bad thing, that  those fakes virtually destroy the market for real ones!

Semper pax
helcaraxe

[Robert_Brenchley]

Here are some hopefully genuine ones from Coinarchives, but even there there's the odd one with wild hair.

http://www.coinarchives.com/a/results.php?results=100&search=Histiaia

[helcaraxe]

In the list you posted, there are three with the wild hair.

I think these two are definitely fake:
[DEAD LINKS REMOVED BY ADMIN]

But I am not sure about this one:
[DEAD LINK REMOVED BY ADMIN]

The style of the reverse is much better than with the other ones. I think it is original. What do you think?

Semper pax
helcaraxe

[areich]

The first is by the seller of No. 3 (but an earlier sale), the second is No. 5 from above.

[Ilya Prokopov]

Please, have a look at the Fake reports - under Hellenistic Monarchies or Last added - these are coins I have photographed at low resolution so I cannot publish them one by one.