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Author Topic: Athens Owl  (Read 3467 times)

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4to2CentBCphilia

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Athens Owl
« on: February 23, 2007, 01:25:54 pm »
Ok, I guess I will post this now since it seems to have garnered enough votes at Best of Type.

It is arguably my favorite coin, although it obviously is not rare.

Dealer photo and my photo (also gives you an idea how lighting can change a coins appearance). In hand, in non abusive lighting conditions, it tends to look more like the color photo.

ATTICA: Athens. After 449 BC. AR tetradrachm (17.07 gm). Head of Athena right, wearing helmet ornamented with vine scroll and laurel leaves / Owl standing right, head facing, AQE to right, olive sprig and crescent to left, all within incuse square. Starr pl. xxii, 6’. SNG Copenhagen 33. EF


Offline CANTANATRIX

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Re: Athens Owl
« Reply #1 on: February 24, 2007, 07:41:50 am »
A suberb owl, lovely high relief! I can easily see how its possibly your favourite coin  :)
"Quickly, bring me a beaker of wine, so that I may wet my mind and say something clever." Aristophanes

"He is a wise man who invented beer." Plato

Offline Rupert

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Re: Athens Owl
« Reply #2 on: February 24, 2007, 07:45:48 am »
These coins have such high relief that the real high spots, like Athena's hair or the owl's eyes and beak, either didn't get struck well or got worn off almost immediately. An owl in this condition is something rare and expensive, especially since flan, centering and style are very good too. Congratulations to this great coin!!

Rupert
Ducunt volentem fata, nolentem trahunt.

4to2CentBCphilia

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Re: Athens Owl
« Reply #3 on: February 24, 2007, 10:55:43 am »
These coins have such high relief that the real high spots, like Athena's hair or the owl's eyes and beak, either didn't get struck well or got worn off almost immediately. An owl in this condition is something rare and expensive, especially since flan, centering and style are very good too. Congratulations to this great coin!!

Rupert

Thanks.

This was not even a coin I was looking to get but when I saw F&S list a bunch of them and someone told me a hoard had been found, I pinged them to see what they had, that wasn't listed yet. I asked for the best they had and this is what I got after reviewing dozens of photos. I saw Tori Freeman at Gemini and told her it was a steal for the price. I can't imagine ever parting with it.
 
In fact, this will probably be the coin that pays the boatman for me someday.  :angel:

BR

Mark

Vladimir

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Re: Athens Owl
« Reply #4 on: February 24, 2007, 11:32:30 am »
does anyone  have any  idea how many coins of this type did survive?  I know that this coin  does appear often, but still  it cost more than  many of the rare ones, even  of a nice ones. Congratulations with the coin, btw, impressive.

4to2CentBCphilia

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Re: Athens Owl
« Reply #5 on: February 24, 2007, 11:57:08 am »
does anyone  have any  idea how many coins of this type did survive?  I know that this coin  does appear often, but still  it cost more than  many of the rare ones, even  of a nice ones. Congratulations with the coin, btw, impressive.

Someone else can comment here, but my understanding is that these are one of the most plentiful Greek coins available. Two main factors affect their price.

The first is there is a high demand among collectors. This type of coin is sort of like the Spanish Doubloon or US Morgan Dollar of its time. Therefore most people want one in their collection, regardless of their collecting focus.

The second is quality. As rupert mentioned, they are often worn down from circulation and the nature of their high relief. Also, many of these have test cuts or are poorly centered. The result is that you can find coins with one side well centered and the other side off center, or one side slightly worn and the other not, etc. It gets very hard to find everything just right. I know I have looked at over 3-4,000 of these and maybe 50-100 are well centered on both sides with minimal wear. And even then, you  have to see how well the engraver did Athena (bad noses, stretched features).

SO this accounts for the apparently lopsided prices. In fact, with the recent flood on the market, only the lowest quality coins have shown a decrease in price. The top ones have actually gone up in price. I can't really give you a good explanation for that, unless it has made more people aware of this style coin and people are trying to get the better ones.

Just my free (and minor) opinion.

BR

Mark

Offline Rupert

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Re: Athens Owl
« Reply #6 on: February 24, 2007, 06:38:26 pm »
NOW... here's my "Worst of Type" specimen.

I picked this up years ago at a coin show for 20 DEM (10 Euro) just out of pity. The coin is so worn that it is even underweight now with 16.42g. It closed the gap a few years before I bought a better one.

Rupert
Ducunt volentem fata, nolentem trahunt.

Offline CANTANATRIX

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Re: Athens Owl
« Reply #7 on: February 25, 2007, 07:01:38 am »
Someone else can comment here, but my understanding is that these are one of the most plentiful Greek coins available. Two main factors affect their price.

The first is there is a high demand among collectors. This type of coin is sort of like the Spanish Doubloon or US Morgan Dollar of its time. Therefore most people want one in their collection, regardless of their collecting focus.

The second is quality. As rupert mentioned, they are often worn down from circulation and the nature of their high relief. Also, many of these have test cuts or are poorly centered. The result is that you can find coins with one side well centered and the other side off center, or one side slightly worn and the other not, etc. It gets very hard to find everything just right. I know I have looked at over 3-4,000 of these and maybe 50-100 are well centered on both sides with minimal wear. And even then, you  have to see how well the engraver did Athena (bad noses, stretched features).

SO this accounts for the apparently lopsided prices. In fact, with the recent flood on the market, only the lowest quality coins have shown a decrease in price. The top ones have actually gone up in price. I can't really give you a good explanation for that, unless it has made more people aware of this style coin and people are trying to get the better ones.

Just my free (and minor) opinion.

I agree, and whilst my example may suffer from several of those factors (test-cut, wear, the obverse is a bit off-centre) it has a very special and permananet place in my collection. The old-style Athens tetradrachm is an iconic and visually appealing coin minted by the most famous of the Greek City-states at the time of its greatest power. It is small wonder why theya re so sought-after  :)

Andy
"Quickly, bring me a beaker of wine, so that I may wet my mind and say something clever." Aristophanes

"He is a wise man who invented beer." Plato

Offline Noah

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Re: Athens Owl
« Reply #8 on: February 25, 2007, 11:38:43 am »
Rupert, even the "worse" example you showed is nice.  I have yet to see bad example of this popular specimen.  Of course, it is not as nice as 4to2Cent's, but I would not turn it down!

Best, Noah

Offline Tiathena

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Re: Athens Owl
« Reply #9 on: February 26, 2007, 02:49:39 pm »
 
     Congratulations indeed!
 
  An absolutely gorgeous coin if ever a gorgeous coin was struck (and they were!).  Quite probably the finest, most beautiful specimen I’ve ever seen over-all.
  Even the flow lines seem only to add to its elegance, if not least it being anathema to the eye & the instinct that anything could or should detract…
 
   Most deserving of ‘Best of the Type!’
 
  From mint to mint..!
  Once a mint to strike them, then a mint to acquire them…
 
  Best,
  Tia
 
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4to2CentBCphilia

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Re: Athens Owl
« Reply #10 on: February 26, 2007, 07:04:36 pm »

     Congratulations indeed!
 
  An absolutely gorgeous coin if ever a gorgeous coin was struck (and they were!).  Quite probably the finest, most beautiful specimen I’ve ever seen over-all.
  Even the flow lines seem only to add to its elegance, if not least it being anathema to the eye & the instinct that anything could or should detract…
 
   Most deserving of ‘Best of the Type!’
 
  From mint to mint..!
  Once a mint to strike them, then a mint to acquire them…
 
  Best,
  Tia
 

And therein lies the difference between a collector and a non-collector.

Two weeks ago, I was offered over double what I paid, and I politely declined without hesitation. I can't imagine parting with this.

My spouse on the other hand thinks I was nuts to turn down the offer.   ???

A silly piece of expensive metal to some, a piece of history that can't be defined by money to others (i.e. collectors).

Sigh

Mark


Offline Tiathena

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Re: Athens Owl
« Reply #11 on: February 26, 2007, 08:46:23 pm »
 
   Were it mine, I too would refuse all offers and likely keep it for sake of promise to Charon – enough to cross at least six times…  More if he favored it beyond its weight.
 
   Best,
   Tia
 
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Offline Noah

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Re: Athens Owl
« Reply #12 on: February 26, 2007, 10:31:54 pm »
There was a reason you were offered twice what you shelled out.  Such a coin would be foolish to part with as not many of this calibre are readily available.

Best, Noah

 

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