Classical Numismatics Discussion
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FORVM`s Classical Numismatics Discussion Board  |  Numismatic and History Discussions  |  Medieval, Islamic and Crusader Coins (Moderators: AlexB, quadrans)  |  Topic: Need help with unknown coin, maybe medieval spanish? 0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic. « previous next »
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Author Topic: Need help with unknown coin, maybe medieval spanish?  (Read 5058 times)
mdo003
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« on: January 04, 2007, 03:47:39 pm »

dont know much about medieval coins, i bought a few medievals though and am having trouble identifying this one since there isnt any writing on it, the guy i bought the lot from said he thought they were mostly spanish between 1000-1700
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mdo003
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« Reply #1 on: January 04, 2007, 03:48:41 pm »

heres the pic
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mauseus
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« Reply #2 on: January 04, 2007, 04:11:00 pm »

Hi,

Your coin is Spanish from c.1600, the type that was heavily countermarked and revalued (although yours seems to have avoided the over stamping). I can't see the date, denomination (possibly a 4 or 8 maravedis piece) or mintmark.

For some countermarked examples of these coins see my gallery here:

http://www.forumancientcoins.com/gallery/thumbnails.php?album=600.

A countermarked 1620's coin below, overstamped in the 1630's and 1640's from Madrid
 

Regards,

Mauseus
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mdo003
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« Reply #3 on: January 05, 2007, 04:49:51 am »

thanks!

do you think the lack of countermark would add/subtract from the value? and exactly what kind of piece would this be, would it just be called a maravedis? i got another coin that by looking through pics on ebay i thought was probably a marvedis too but it looks a lot different, something like this http://toolie.myweb.uga.edu/maravedis.jpg (mine is soaking in distilled water so i cant scan it right now)  thanks again!
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Corduba
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« Reply #4 on: January 07, 2007, 04:56:55 pm »

Your coin is 8 maravedís minted if i´m not wrong between 1621-1626.

I am not a this coin collector but i can tell you about the countermarks this. It´s from a book "Las monedas reselladas de Felipe III y Felipe IV (1603-1659)" by Joaquín Centeno Yáñez. It´s really hard to undertand writed in spanish and i´ll try to translate to english so sorry for all my mistakes.

First Felipe III was king between 1598 and 1621. Felipe IV was king between 1621 and 1665.

About the evolution of the value of the bronze coinage during this time (1602-1659), you have to distinguish between the value of the "calderilla", (billon coins minted before 1597); the billon coins minted between 1597 and 1602 at Segovia; the bronze coins minted after at Segovia and the rest of the mints.

Till 1602 all Billon coins had silver and the same value, 4 and 2 maravedís whatever the mint was.

At 1603 was the first countermark. The billon was doubled but only was countermarked the “calderilla” and the billon coins minted at Segovia between 1597 and 1602. A new coins was created with 6,57 gr. of weight for  the 8 maravedís coin(before the weight for the 4 maravedís coins) and 3,28 for the 4 coins. These new coin had no silver, the old ones was billon coins. That the reason the old coins had doubled the value.

Almost no coin was minted since 1606 to 1621. At 1606 was forbidden the minted of bronze coinage. At 1611 and 1612 was allowed but only to pay the royal workers and only minted in Segovia. Only this mint worked till 1617. At 1619 besides Segovia, other mints worked but without permission: Cuenca, Toledo, Burgos and Madrid. At 1620 besides these mints you can find coin of Valladolid.

Between 1621-1626 a massive number of coins was minted like your coin. After 1626 almost no bronze coins was minted till 1660.

At 1628 the value of the all bronze coinage got down to the middle. The same value than it had before 1602.

At 1636 another countermark was created. This one multiplies by three the coins value at 1628. The coins countermarked were the 2 maravedís coin to 6 and the 4 to 12. This countermark was only for the calderilla coins and the coin minted at Segovia (1597-1602).

At 1641, the others mints coins were countermarked, but only the 4 maravedís coins. The new value was 8 maravedís.

At 1642 the Segovia mint coins minted after 1602 were countermarked too. The 2 maravedís coins went to 6 and the 4 maravedís went to 12.

After, in 1642 all the 12 and 8 maravedís coins went down to 2 maravedís coins and the 6 and 4 went down to 1 maravedí.

At 1643 the “calderilla” increased their value. 4 times. So the 2 maravedís coins went to 8 and the 1 maravedí went to 4.

At November 11th 1651 the rest of the bronze coinage (all except the “calderilla” coins) was countermarked. The 2 maravedís coins went to 8 and the1 went to 4 maravedís.

At 1652, the 1651 countermarked was forbidden, so this coinage went down to 2 and 1 maravedí again.

At least in 1658-1659 the coins value went to the double. The 2 maravedís coins went to 4 and the 1 went to 2. This countermarked was only for the bronze coinage not for the “calderilla” which maintained their value since 1643.

I hope somebody understand this post.

Best regards,
Ignacio.
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FORVM`s Classical Numismatics Discussion Board  |  Numismatic and History Discussions  |  Medieval, Islamic and Crusader Coins (Moderators: AlexB, quadrans)  |  Topic: Need help with unknown coin, maybe medieval spanish? « previous next »
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