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FORVM`s Classical Numismatics Discussion Board  |  Numismatic and History Discussions  |  Celtic Coins  |  Topic: Ring money ? 0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic. « previous next »
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Carolus Magnus
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« on: August 31, 2006, 07:22:40 pm »

I know this subject has come up in the past, but is this a type of ring money? their is a site referenced in a related thread that seems to  acknowlege that it is, unfortunatly it is in a language that I don't understand. My questions are these. Is this a form of ring money?, and if so is it of a rarer type? is there any method of valuing this type.? This example was found on the site I quoted above. I do own 4 similar pieces. any help would be appreciated
                                                       
                                                                                                           CT
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Carolus Magnus
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« Reply #1 on: September 01, 2006, 10:27:37 pm »

Bump?
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basemetal
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« Reply #2 on: September 07, 2006, 07:48:16 pm »

Hello all!
I usually am on the ancient roman coins and history part of this forum, but I'd like to ask a question and not be flamed to harshly if possible.
I see "ring money" for sale and mentioned a lot.  I know it's a legitimate form of currency, but I'm wondering about some I see offered for sale.
Some of the brass and copper "ring money" looks to me like it might actually have been, and this is not a correct term but a description, connecting or fastening rings for clothing, armor, equestrian gear and similar.  Am I wrong?
Perhaps someone here could steer me to a site discussing ring money and similar.
Thank you all in advance.
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Carolus Magnus
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« Reply #3 on: September 07, 2006, 08:09:21 pm »

Hi Basemetal

Some say that it is, and some say that it isn't. Reputable sellers sell this item on their site. If you do a search on ring money on this thread you will find the site I referenced above. As for me, I am not too sure either way. Those that say it isn't , have a pretty convincing argument. A ring of those sizes would seem just about right to join 2 leather straps. I guess it depends if you have some to sell or not.
                                                                                                 Chuck T
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basemetal
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« Reply #4 on: September 08, 2006, 06:10:31 pm »

Lol...Chuck!  I love your logic!  Brass is brass and copper is copper and in those times each was worth it's weight in.....brass or copper.  I've often stated on the roman coin sites that we moderns are probably more interested in the inscriptions on the coins than the ancients were.  A denarius was a denarius and the spenders probably held their noses and went ahead and spent that denarius of that despicable Commodus without a second thought.
There is a plethora of modern silver bars of various sizes that advertise most everything from Coors beer to ..you name it.  They are still worth (excluding some rare stamping of something) whatever the going rate for silver is.
A large bronze ring, whatever it's original purpose was, was still possibly  the equivalent of the weight of a bronze coin or coins.   It's shape may or may not have influenced it's final worth.  Metal was scarce in a way we moderns cannot quite comprehend.

"Dammit!  I am without funds.  All I have is this ....binding ring that my father gave me. It's from his original kit when he was in service to the great..........  It's pure brass and weighs as much as a lead shot."
Albenginius:
"Not to worry friend Consiginius!  The innkeeper yonder knows good pure brass when he sees it!
Along with my coins, and your ring, we'll dine and drink well tonight and ..I've heard he has women that can be made "available" for the right price."
A bit of fantasy, but you get my point.
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Carolus Magnus
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« Reply #5 on: September 08, 2006, 06:40:49 pm »

And I my friend love your imagination! In all reality tho, it surely has the " Ring " of truth to it. ( Sorry for the bad pun ). I imagine that all types of metal had value in ancient times, and that some cultures did not have the skill to engrave dies for coins. Even ancient Rome used (what appears to me anyway) lumps of bronze for currency at one time. Who knows. I would be willing to bet, that if I went to the local bar tonight with some of this "Ring Money" in hand that I could exchange it with someone for a couple of drinks. I would without a doubt need quite a few coins for any female companionship tho.

                                                                              Chuck T
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basemetal
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« Reply #6 on: September 08, 2006, 07:32:59 pm »

Lol....actually female companionship was quite ah...reasonable.  If you think in cold and pragmatic terms,
wine-making was a fairly complicated process as was some food preparation.  Female companionship was
ah...homegrown by nature especially given the needs of clients of ladies of the evening...also  given that no emotional ties were concerned and it was a quite legal enterprise and there were so, so many poverty stricken women in the ancient world.  So your total bill including "entertainment" would probably be one in which the "entertainment" was the least expensive. Sadly true, I think.
But entrepenures being what they have been for way more than 2000 years,  you could get "filet mingon" "prime rib"  or, if on a budget, "ribeye" , or even "beef tips" if you get my metaphor.
Exactly like with modern ladies of the night, you get the act and little else.
Ancient and modern writings are rife with the mention of swords, swords, swords, and helmets, armour, and all the military trappings we are familiar with.  In reality, the average family that hoped to have his/her son enlist in other than auxilaries, would have to come up with the kit for a calvaryman or a first-line roman soldier.  It's been likened to a modern soldier having to come up with the cost of an F-16 in order to be one of the elite.
The great majority of the peasant class quite possibly had never seen an aureus or celtic equivalent and never would during a normal lifespan. He/she may have seen silver in the  marketplace or similar, but would never in his/her wildest dreams think of owning one.  Hence the attraction for joining the army even as an auxilary and possibly looting and pillaging and gaining ownership of one or more.
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Carolus Magnus
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« Reply #7 on: September 09, 2006, 11:16:10 pm »

We are really getting way off topic here, but you either have a great deal of insight into the way things once were, or perhaps served in the Legion in a prior life. How we got here from celtic ring money I'll never know. Come to think of it, I never did get an answer from someone in authority about the legitimacy of these things. Anybody?
                                                                                                        Chuck T
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basemetal
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« Reply #8 on: September 10, 2006, 04:35:30 pm »

Lol....Chuck.  How we got from there to here is part of my attraction to ancient coins.  Taken purely at "face" value a coin is a piece of metal with an inscription on it.  If that were the limit, we could all save a lot of money by purchasing Warren's copies, or for that matter cutting out images of ancient coins and pasting them in a notebook.   
We all know the difference.  When you hold an ancient coin in  your hand, unless you are unimaginably
unimaginative, you automatically wonder where it traveled before it began it's long sleep underground.
Who held it?  How did that ancient dent on one side get there?  Probably in some mundane way but also a chance that it got there by being pounded on the table of some long gone and lost in time tavern by a soldier who while pounding was shouting:
"Innkeeper!  More wine here! And not that vinegar you sell to everyone!  This is a sestertius of the mighty Trajan, now a hallowed god! More wine I say!"
I cannot understand some types of coin collectors that revel in the minuate of a dot or swirl on a coin to the exclusion of the wonder that it is. Not that that is unimportant.  I am never satisfied until a coin is attributed by me, or someone else, but as a part of where and when the coin was.
Oh, this is while we are waiting for that authrotative answer.
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