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Author Topic: Sarmatia Devicta OTD  (Read 1432 times)

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Offline wolfgang336

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Sarmatia Devicta OTD
« on: April 04, 2021, 11:18:52 pm »
Nothing rare, but a nice little example of one of my favorite types.

Constantine I

CONSTAN-TINVS AVG, laureate right / SARMATIA DEVICTA, Victory delivering a rather vicious kick to a surprised looking Sarmatian
STR  :crescent: in exergue.

RIC 435, Choice EF

The patina is a gloss black in hand, which is a bit challenging to capture on an Android phone. Still, I think I did well!

Online quadrans

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Re: Sarmatia Devicta OTD
« Reply #1 on: April 05, 2021, 03:12:26 am »
Nice coin 👍

Q.
All the Best :), Joe
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Offline *Alex

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Re: Sarmatia Devicta OTD
« Reply #2 on: April 05, 2021, 07:41:14 am »
Nice coin with nice details and you did well with the photo too.

Alex

Offline Heliodromus

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Re: Sarmatia Devicta OTD
« Reply #3 on: April 05, 2021, 02:28:26 pm »
Nice coin!

I think RIC may have the order of the two Trier Sarmatia issues (RIC 429, 435) reversed, so that your type with P/STR :crescent: comes first. That way we have synced mintmarks for the first issue of this type at all of London, Trier and Lyons (PLON :crescent:, PTR :crescent:, PLG :crescent:). The bust styles seem to support this. Arles, as per usual, was doing somewhat of it's own thing, using "P*AR".

Was this taken in sunlight ?

Ben

Offline okidoki

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Re: Sarmatia Devicta OTD
« Reply #4 on: April 05, 2021, 03:59:16 pm »
indeed great looks
All the Best,
Eric
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Offline wolfgang336

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Re: Sarmatia Devicta OTD
« Reply #5 on: April 05, 2021, 05:00:36 pm »
Thanks everybody!

Nice coin!

I think RIC may have the order of the two Trier Sarmatia issues (RIC 429, 435) reversed, so that your type with P/STR :crescent: comes first. That way we have synced mintmarks for the first issue of this type at all of London, Trier and Lyons (PLON :crescent:, PTR :crescent:, PLG :crescent:). The bust styles seem to support this. Arles, as per usual, was doing somewhat of it's own thing, using "P*AR".

Was this taken in sunlight ?

Ben


Yes, this was taken in sunlight (on a cloudy day). I've found that sunny days don't work well for photographing bronze, and I haven't been able to get artificial light to work.

Offline Heliodromus

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Re: Sarmatia Devicta OTD
« Reply #6 on: April 05, 2021, 05:49:56 pm »
Yes, this was taken in sunlight (on a cloudy day). I've found that sunny days don't work well for photographing bronze, and I haven't been able to get artificial light to work.

Yep, full sun tends to make most bronzes look very rough. In the past the past I've tried taping clear polythene or bubble-wrap to the window as a diffuser, which can help, but not the most convenient.

I've yet to find a lighting setup that I'm happy with. My next attempt will be a bright LED panel light with a diffuser in front of it - something that hopefully might come close to the desirable qualities of sunlight - a large bright, diffused (on the right day), unidirectional source.

Ben

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Re: Sarmatia Devicta OTD
« Reply #7 on: April 06, 2021, 03:07:04 pm »
I have both of the Trier types: RIC 429 and RIC VII 435,

RIC 429 :

https://www.forumancientcoins.com/gallery/displayimage.php?pos=-130859

Interesting one, of the 436 var because this is thicker (double) and very high weight, weight: 5,22g !!! , thickness: 2,6mm !!! , :

https://www.forumancientcoins.com/gallery/displayimage.php?pos=-84612

And of course, I have a piece of Sirmium too:

https://www.forumancientcoins.com/gallery/displayimage.php?pos=-89372
https://www.forumancientcoins.com/gallery/displayimage.php?pos=-82892


Regards

 Joe/Q.

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Offline wolfgang336

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Re: Sarmatia Devicta OTD
« Reply #8 on: April 06, 2021, 05:44:09 pm »
Quote from: quadrans on April 06, 2021, 03:07:04 pm
I have both of the Trier types: RIC 429 and RIC VII 435,

RIC 429 :

https://www.forumancientcoins.com/gallery/displayimage.php?pos=-130859

Interesting one, of the 436 var because this is thicker (double) and very high weight, weight: 5,22g !!! , thickness: 2,6mm !!! , :

https://www.forumancientcoins.com/gallery/displayimage.php?pos=-84612

And of course, I have a piece of Sirmium too:

https://www.forumancientcoins.com/gallery/displayimage.php?pos=-89372
https://www.forumancientcoins.com/gallery/displayimage.php?pos=-82892


I wonder if your double weight example is actually two flans which got stuck (and then struck) together?

The first Sirmium piece is spectacular.

To round us out (apart from Arles and London...), here's my Lugdunum example (RIC 214) with the crescent mintmark, which would sync (to use Ben's word) with my Trier piece above. Constantine is looking a bit bug-eyed...



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Re: Sarmatia Devicta OTD
« Reply #9 on: April 06, 2021, 06:52:08 pm »
Yes, the double-thick coin really looks like a one-piece, rarity, found on the NOT IN RIC page ...
I like the London piece I don't have a piece of it yet. I have a few more of the others.

best regards

Joe
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Offline David Atherton

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Re: Sarmatia Devicta OTD
« Reply #10 on: April 08, 2021, 12:11:40 am »
Super coin Evan. I bet it's really impressive in hand.

Offline SC

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Re: Sarmatia Devicta OTD
« Reply #11 on: April 08, 2021, 09:32:00 am »
Nice.

I always liked this coin type, and the related ALAMANNIA DEVICTA.

At a time when most reverse legends were becoming more generic, or at least less clear as to whether they were referring to any specific event, we still have these two types linked to specific military victories just like the great sestertii of the 1st and 2nd centuries.

Plus, unlike those sestertii, it is possible for us normal folks to acquire near-perfect examples.

SC

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Offline Virgil H

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Re: Sarmatia Devicta OTD
« Reply #12 on: April 08, 2021, 09:38:03 pm »
Beautiful coin and I wish I could get my photography that good.
Virgil

Offline Heliodromus

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Re: Sarmatia Devicta OTD
« Reply #13 on: April 09, 2021, 10:32:06 am »
One of the interesting things with Constantine's reign is the changing cast and territories due to various factors, one of which was Constantine's giving control of Gaul to Crispus in 317 AD, as we see reflected in the coinage. While Crispus's mints *roughly* followed the types being issued elsewhere by Constantine, there were some major differences, such as this Sarmatia Devicta type.

At Constantine's mints starting c.320 AD we have his new "VOT XX" type, initially issued alongside "VOT V" for the caesars, then continuing with "VOT X". At the same time Crispus instead initially issued "BEATA TRANQVILITAS" (with Constantine's vows relegated to the VO-TIS XX altar inscription), ignored the "VOT V" type, then issued "SARMATIA DEVICTA" alongside "VOT X" :


Crispus                        Constantine

BEATA TRAQVILITAS (VO-TIS XX)  VOT XX, VOT V
SARMATIA DEVICTA, VOT X        VOT XX, VOT X


Put against this pattern, we see Arles basically following Constantine's pattern of vota issues, but additionally issuing SARMATIA DEVICTA (presumably starting at the same time as the other mints, alongside VOT X). We see another sign of Arles independence from Crispus in the earlier VIRTVS EXERCIT issue, which at London, Trier and Lyons (but not Arles) had included a trophy as well as vota-standard type.

I'm not sure how specific the ancient sources are on exactly what territory was controlled by Crispus, but per the coinage it seems to be the mints of London, Trier and Lyons, but NOT Arles. If we map this to administrative areas, this implies Crispus had control of the dioceses of Galliae and Britanniae, but not of Viennensis (containing Arles).

It's not clear, to me at least, exactly where Constantine's battles against the Sarmatians, at this time, had occurred. The Sarmatians are generally an eastern tribe, but certainly later ventured as far west as Pannoniae which they invaded. It's not obvious therefore whether the "SARMATIA DEVICTA" type had any particular local relevance to Gaul in terms of border security (certainly not to Arles!), or was just commemorating Constantine's victories further east. The only other mint to issue the "SARMATIA DEVICTA" type was Sirmium over in the east.

Here's my Arles specimens of the type. Arles showing it's independence by also issuing cuirassed busts.

Ben

Offline wolfgang336

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Re: Sarmatia Devicta OTD
« Reply #14 on: April 11, 2021, 06:45:56 pm »
Beautiful coin and I wish I could get my photography that good.
Virgil

This was surprisingly easy. I just put the coin on a white page on a windowsill, then stack a few books next to it. On top of the books I rest my Samsung Galaxy S10 with the camera lens peaking over the end and onto the coin. You can zoom and adjust the brightness in the default camera app. To avoid blur, i just put the camera on a 2 second timer. That way, it's perfectly still when the image is captured.

Then there's just a bit of photo editing to do.

The whole process takes perhaps an hour, which is a fairly nice way of spending time when there's nothing else to do (thanks COVID!).

Quote
At a time when most reverse legends were becoming more generic, or at least less clear as to whether they were referring to any specific event, we still have these two types linked to specific military victories just like the great sestertii of the 1st and 2nd centuries.

This has always struck me too. I had wondered whether Constantine was issuing these coins as a way of provoking Licinius, into whose territory he had trespassed while fighting the Sarmatians. I'm not certain whether that reasoning holds up given Crispus' Alamannia Devicta type (I don't know whether this tribe was similarly adjacent to Licinius' territory?).

Evan

Offline SC

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Re: Sarmatia Devicta OTD
« Reply #15 on: April 12, 2021, 09:19:34 am »
Interesting thought.

The Alamannia were along the Rhine so nowhere near Licinius.  But that type might have been an afterthought in an attempt to add to Crispus' prestige.

SC
SC
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Offline Heliodromus

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Re: Sarmatia Devicta OTD
« Reply #16 on: April 12, 2021, 04:10:03 pm »
Here's a rough idea of where these tribes were located, and where Constantine's battles against the Sarmatian's would have taken place.

There's a WikiPedia article on the Sarmatians which describes their greatest extent in the 1st C AD as extending westward towards the Vistula river and mouth of the Danube (on the black sea). This seems to agree with a reference I found here to Diocletian's "limes Sarmaticus" running from eastern Pannoniae to Upper Moesiae, which must be roughly the regions these battles took place.

Constantine's crossing over into Licinius' territory wasn't part of these battles against the Sarmatians. It happened about a year and a half later, when pursuing Goths who had crossed the Danube into the Moesia Inferior region extending from upper Thraciae into Constantine's territory.

So, given the distance from Crispus's mints issuing the Sarmatia Devicta type, it seems the type was more a matter of honoring Constantine's victory rather than assuring the locals of close-to-home border security (as the later campgate series did). Given that Crispus had chosen not to participate in his fathers's VOT XX type, and given the mistrust evidenced by his demise a few years later, Crispus may have been well advised to show some respect!

Ben

 

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