Classical Numismatics Discussion
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Author Topic: Has Anyone Ever Seen This? No One I Know Has: Authors, &c. Hasmonean? Anything?  (Read 1146 times)

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Offline Pete B

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Hello Everyone! Is anyone familiar with this "coin"? It was bought from a major auction house as "Greek Coin 2nd-1stC BC AE-24 16.37 grams"
First of all, it's made of Lead. Devices are: Single Cornucopia with a Pomegranate to the left; other things to the right/Eight Rayed Star. The "denticles" were added piecemeal, maybe to help with it's weight? It weighs the same as a Tetradrachm, and appears to be shaved on the right obverse edge to correct its weight? These devices are traditionally matched to Hasmonean Alexander Jannaeus? The devices appear on his coins-but not together (and the Cornucopia  is twinned on those that have them). No one has ever seen one before, and that includes People who would know these things. Bithynian King(s) Nikomedes II, II and/or IV issued a sole bronze coin with a nine-pointed star/cornucopia + legend. I think they struck those for Trade with Jerusalem (and added an extra point to the star because, well, they're Bithnyians). Otherwise, bupkis...

Offline Pete B

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I could really use some help with this item. No one has ever seen one before, and has no idea of its origin. I think it's pretty obvious what it is...

Offline Pekka K

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Here is one item with similar properties (24mm, 16.17g, PB):

https://www.acsearch.info/search.html?id=5772374

named:  Roman PB Tessera, c. 1st century BC - 1st century AD.

Pekka K

Offline Pete B

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Thank You! I was think possible tessera also, but the obverse beaded border on mine was added by hand. That's much too tedious work for a  common tess I'd think

Offline Pekka K

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Dotted border was added to mold or die, depending
if cast or struck.

Pekka K

Offline Pete B

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If you'll notice, they all have "collars" as if they were punched into the item...

Offline Pete B

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at 11:00 you can see where one of them popped off

Offline djmacdo

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A few minutes with a drill on a soft bronze die would add a blobby dotted border without much inconvenience.  After all, the die only needed to be strong enough to strike lead.  Or if cast, it would take even less effort to add such a dotted border to the mold.

Offline Pete B

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Yes, true that, but it's not the case here...

Offline glebe

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Thank You! I was think possible tessera also, but the obverse beaded border on mine was added by hand. That's much too tedious work for a  common tess I'd think

How else would you add it?

Ross G.

Offline Pete B

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The beads were not "in die" struck with the coin; they were added one-by-one to it after the piece was formed

Offline PMah

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Pete B, your point is not clear:  are you saying someone would expend effort adding tiny dots of metal separately to a soft lead object, rather than engraving the dots into a die or mold for mass production?  If this item is made of lead, it was not a high-value item when made, even if it is hard to find other specimens today.   Even a lead decorative item was likely mass-produced.
    Weight adjustments to ancient gold or silver coins were sometimes made to reduce the weight of over-weight pieces.  But under-weight  precious metal coins are common.  Under-weight base metal coins are very common, even when the coins were at least nominally valued by weight.  Coin users just did not seem to care about tiny differences in base metal coins.
  If you are saying the shapes were carved into the lead flan, that might make sense for a decorative object, but not for a low-value lead coin. 
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Offline Pete B

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Yup, that's exactly what I'm saying: the beads are all "collared", and one popped-off the flan at about 11:30. Flat field underneath that bead
It weighs the same as a Tetradrachm
I'm trying to find out who/what the devices link to; I have my ideas

The person who originally received the collection, but didn't catalogue the auction, thinks that it is a weight as well
but has no info as to its origins (like an old envelope with info as to where it was salvaged)

 

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