Puzzling mini Bronze Ptolemy .8gr x 12.2mm Svoronos 1162 (?) Any ideas?

[coldavo]

Hi All,

Sadly I missed out on this item which was on offer recently.

It is what appears to be the mini bronze Svoronos 1162 and measures 12.2mm diameter x .8 of a gram in weight.

However, I am completely puzzled by the obverse.

These days, often identified as Cleopatra, this obverse appears to show a male head with an unusual headdress (possibly with a "tail" at the back). I've compared it with a number of illustrations of the "Cleopatra" type and, although the reverse ties up nicely I can't find anywhere a near match for the obverse - even with some of the cruder types.

Just for interest's sake - any ideas?

All the best,
Col

[Altamura]

In my eyes this is not a new variant  . On your coin there are some encrustations, so that the head cannot be seen completely clear. And the "Tail" also could be a die break.

Regards

Altamura

[djmacdo]

I agree.

[PtolemAE]

Hi All,

Sadly I missed out on this item which was on offer recently.

It is what appears to be the mini bronze Svoronos 1162 and measures 12.2mm diameter x .8 of a gram in weight.

However, I am completely puzzled by the obverse.
...

All the best,
Col

Looks like a plain vanilla Sv 1162 with some dirt or other encrustations on the obverse.  Its weight is in the range of known specimens from just under 0.8 to about 1.5 grams, average about 1.1 grams.

PtolemAE

[Dino]

I don't think it's a new variant either.

[coldavo]

Hi All,

Sorry for the delay - I was away from my computer.

Thank you for your comments. As mentioned, the coin is not mine and I was going on the photographs. I did check it against a fair number of the more unusual heads shown on this Svoronos number and, with your comments, accept it as simply another similar unusual head.

Apparently I am easily puzzled. I considered the possibility of a die-crack , both front and back, of the "cap" and also the probability of the "standard" ear drops which appear to show.

What puzzled me was that the flat section at the top front of the head seems, because of the shadow, to be well above the surrounding (dirt encrusted) field and so possibly no extra head details. There is no trace of a bun (probably because of encrustation) and the figure has an extremely strong chin and cheek.

Now I am rather glad that I missed out as my interest was purely in its "difference".

Thanks again,
All the best,
Col

[djmacdo]

I know the feeling!  Reminds me of St. Theresa of Avila who is supposed to have said that sometimes God's greatest mercy is not to answer prayer!

[PtolemAE]

Hi All,

Sorry for the delay - I was away from my computer.

Thank you for your comments. As mentioned, the coin is not mine and I was going on the photographs. I did check it against a fair number of the more unusual heads shown on this Svoronos number and, with your comments, accept it as simply another similar unusual head.

Apparently I am easily puzzled. I considered the possibility of a die-crack , both front and back, of the "cap" and also the probability of the "standard" ear drops which appear to show.

What puzzled me was that the flat section at the top front of the head seems, because of the shadow, to be well above the surrounding (dirt encrusted) field and so possibly no extra head details. There is no trace of a bun (probably because of encrustation) and the figure has an extremely strong chin and cheek.

Now I am rather glad that I missed out as my interest was purely in its "difference".

Thanks again,
All the best,
Col

Variations on small coin types made in huge quantities are more rule than exception.  Very likely if you examine a bunch more of these you'll find more variations.  A minor artistic or 'make' variation on a very small common coin type might be notable or interesting to the finder but irrelevant to another collector with less free time .  Otherwise 'irrelevant' variations are the raw data of die studies, and you might wish to do one as long as you're taking the time to examine many examples in detail.  Accumulate enough small peculiarities and you might uncover a pattern that adds to what little we know about them.  It has happened before. 

PtolemAE