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Author Topic: Stylized Celtic Man-Faced Bull, Help with Dating/Location  (Read 3178 times)

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Offline Molinari

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Stylized Celtic Man-Faced Bull, Help with Dating/Location
« on: November 05, 2015, 07:26:12 am »
I really couldn't believe my eyes yesterday when I saw this "uncertan" coin listed.  It is only 14mm and 1.41g.  I believe it shows a stylized Herakles wearing Nemean Lion Headress on its obverse, and, more importantly, a stylized forepart of a man-faced bull to left on its reverse!  The beard and how it encircles the mouth is what really gives it away, in my opinion.

Can anyone tell me where this might have come from based on the the style of the obverse and physical characteristics of the flan?  I'm thinking the Remi or Senones.

Offline Molinari

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Re: Stylized Celtic Man-Faced Bull, Help with Dating/Location
« Reply #1 on: November 05, 2015, 07:28:54 am »
reverse enlargement

Offline Molinari

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Re: Stylized Celtic Man-Faced Bull, Help with Dating/Location
« Reply #2 on: November 05, 2015, 11:17:11 am »
One Celtic expert has suggested Danubian rather than Gaulish.  He thought 1 century BC was a reasonable guess. 

Offline Molinari

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Re: Stylized Celtic Man-Faced Bull, Help with Dating/Location
« Reply #3 on: November 05, 2015, 01:03:23 pm »
Here are some issues from the Sesones that I think display a similar obverse style:

GAUL, Northwest. Senones. Ullucci. Circa 100-50 BC. Æ (15mm, 3.13 g, 12h). Celticized head right / Celticized eagle left; YLLVCCI above; to right, pentagram and X surrounded by pellets; two pellets-in-annulets below. D&T 2635; Depeyrot, NC V, 130; CCCBM III 150; de la Tour 7493.

CELTIC, Northwest Gaul. Senones. Circa 100-50 BC. Æ 16mm (2.94 g, 12h). Celtic head right; S ornament before mouth, torque below / Abstract bird left, two pellets within wings; YLLYCCI above, pentagram and retrograde S ornament behind, two pellet-in-annulets below. D&T 2637 var. (ornaments); Depeyrot, NC V, 130 var. (same); CCCBM III -. Good VF, dark green patina

Note also the similar size and weight.  I can't find anything in those parameters for Danubian celts.

Offline Molinari

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Re: Stylized Celtic Man-Faced Bull, Help with Dating/Location
« Reply #4 on: November 06, 2015, 02:33:02 pm »
Someone else suggested obverse is of  "Kapostaler type" - from Hungary/n.Serbia late 3rd to 2nd c. BC.  I'm not seeing a clear resemblance and the coin is very small compared to the examples I've found from that region. However, it could be an imitative copy of a Neapolitan bronze unit from that area, since they were so fond of imitating other types.

Offline Molinari

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NOT a Stylized Celtic Man-Faced Bull
« Reply #5 on: November 07, 2015, 08:16:11 pm »
So I've spent the better part of two days researching this coin, which I spent $80 on, and it turns out it isn't a stylized man-faced bull!  Notice the tail on the back of the "forepart".  The "horn" is actually the horse's neck, and the nose and beard are the front legs which didn't come through when struck!!!

 >:(

Offline quadrans

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Re: Stylized Celtic Man-Faced Bull, Help with Dating/Location
« Reply #6 on: November 08, 2015, 02:33:26 pm »
Hi,

 If I look better of your coin it is look similar origin of my east celtic example...

 https://www.forumancientcoins.com/gallery/displayimage.php?pos=-92553

 regards
 Q.
All the Best :), Joe
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Offline Robert_Brenchley

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Re: Stylized Celtic Man-Faced Bull, Help with Dating/Location
« Reply #7 on: November 08, 2015, 05:34:33 pm »
Interesting coin though, whether it's an MFB or not!
Robert Brenchley

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Offline quadrans

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Re: Stylized Celtic Man-Faced Bull, Help with Dating/Location
« Reply #8 on: November 08, 2015, 06:05:45 pm »
This is not a MFB. This is a Celtic horse galloping to the left, as seen in my coin.
The mount was not good, that is a source of the misunderstanding.
Molinari coin missing the horse's head and front legs.
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