FORVM`s Classical Numismatics Discussion Board

Numismatic and History Discussions => Medieval, Islamic and Crusader Coins => Topic started by: Rugser on June 26, 2003, 04:11:08 pm



Title: COMPETITION FOR TRUE NUMISMATICS
Post by: Rugser on June 26, 2003, 04:11:08 pm

....from my garden....

Bronze- Diameter mm 27

Who is he?

Duration of the competition: 48 hours.

In 30 years I have only see 3 times this coins.
Before mine... one time in a friend of mine hand and one time in sale on " NUMISMATICA ARS CLASSICA.".... but perhaps it was the one of my friend.
Whoever has seen this coin other times is begged to tell me where  he has seen it.

ser  8) 8)


Title: Re:COMPETITION FOR TRUE NUMISMATICS
Post by: Rugser on June 26, 2003, 04:11:47 pm
R


Title: Re:COMPETITION FOR TRUE NUMISMATICS
Post by: LordBest on June 27, 2003, 01:06:05 am
It wouldbt be one of those barbarian Roman senate issues would it? 5th or 6th century or something. I thought i read somewhere they had SC on them... Then again, i dont know much about late Romans, especially this late. :(
                                                LordBest. 8)


Title: Re:COMPETITION FOR TRUE NUMISMATICS
Post by: the_Apostate on June 27, 2003, 02:29:13 am
Puzzling coin! The style is very good for its time or what I believe to be its time, but the celator might have been illiterate. All the most famous barbarian kings seem to be out of question: Genseric, Odoacar, Theodoric, Alboin and Alaric was never a king was he?

The sole man I with a fitting name that I can think of is Avitus, but he was emperor and never king as far I know and the letters read ...atus but if the celator wasn't good with letters that would be no problem -  ;)
 
Of course he wasn't king but I feel desperate...


Title: Re:COMPETITION FOR TRUE NUMISMATICS
Post by: the_Apostate on June 27, 2003, 02:35:14 am
If the SC means anything at all the coin should have been struck before 580-something when the senate last convened. This combined with the title rex on Italian ground would place the coin between 410 - 580 and probably somewhere in the middle of that but the victory reverse would not be wrong on a coin struck earlier.


Title: Re:COMPETITION FOR TRUE NUMISMATICS
Post by: yafet_rasnal on June 27, 2003, 04:43:35 am
I can tell you this ....
- SC stands for Senatus Consulto
- The celatror didn't committ any error with letters  ;D ;D ;D
Perhaps later i will post a pic of the statue of his cousin and ... co-ruler


Title: Re:COMPETITION FOR TRUE NUMISMATICS
Post by: sejanus on June 27, 2003, 10:26:40 am
I am almost positively sure that this is one of those 5th-6th cent. Senate decreed bronzes struck under 'barbarian' (i.e. gothic) rulers.  Upon closer inspection, the reverse says "VICTORIA PRINKIPI......" or "VICTORIA PRINKIP AVG".  Prinkip being the barbarous version of the Latin "princeps" or "principis" (meaning emperor), and thus "Victory of the Emperor Augustus" (not the Augustus of course. ;)).


Title: Re:COMPETITION FOR TRUE NUMISMATICS
Post by: Rugser on June 27, 2003, 03:53:21 pm
HELP NOMBER  2.
- The Victory is on prow
- R/ VICTORIV PRINCIPM
- The person have a hat of cloth with pearls.

ser


Title: Re:COMPETITION FOR TRUE NUMISMATICS
Post by: yafet_rasnal on June 27, 2003, 04:34:52 pm
Here's the pic of this man co-ruler....it's a queen, but not married with this rex  ??? ;D


Title: Re:COMPETITION FOR TRUE NUMISMATICS
Post by: Rugser on June 27, 2003, 04:52:36 pm
Lor

The hat of the person is similar... but not equal to that of the queen of your pic.

This hat is equal to that of all the barbarians of his people. .but enriched with  pearls "consone" to his rank of king.


Title: Re:COMPETITION FOR TRUE NUMISMATICS
Post by: yafet_rasnal on June 27, 2003, 05:48:49 pm
I can't show you the full legend (or the contest would be end), but at last i can provide a censored pic of the coin in XF condition


Title: Re:COMPETITION FOR TRUE NUMISMATICS
Post by: Rugser on June 27, 2003, 06:01:56 pm
Perfect!

Like the engraver of my coin could be seen is more barbaric.

On the reverse there is any differences...

ser


Title: Re:COMPETITION FOR TRUE NUMISMATICS
Post by: yafet_rasnal on June 27, 2003, 06:16:07 pm
Not so far since that empress was knows on both the capitals as very gorgeous ...but also a great woman a culture ...perhaps one of the most intelligent empress.....


Title: Re:COMPETITION FOR TRUE NUMISMATICS
Post by: yafet_rasnal on June 28, 2003, 07:22:29 am
Ok ...since we are really near to the end of competion i give you the not censured pic of the XF coin....i'm sure now you will find who this guy is  ;)



Title: Re:COMPETITION FOR TRUE NUMISMATICS
Post by: ande3000 on June 28, 2003, 07:28:45 am
Teodato....died in 536 ?


Title: Re:COMPETITION FOR TRUE NUMISMATICS
Post by: yafet_rasnal on June 28, 2003, 07:39:17 am
ANDE ...THE ANSWER IS CORRECT!!!

LOL ....BUT NOW YOU WERE ABLE TO READ THE LEGEND :)
HOWEVER YOU DEMONSTRATED TO KNOW GOTHIC HISTORY  ;D

However the woman was his cousin Amalaunta. If someone wants i will tell you more about these two persons.


Title: Re:COMPETITION FOR TRUE NUMISMATICS
Post by: Rugser on June 28, 2003, 08:04:43 am
I add that this Coin of THEODHATVS is a piece from 40 nummii.

It has stayed coined to Rome in the moment of the maximum harmony of the italic populations reconciles and reunited from the Hostrogots.....Roma tasted the pride of reopen the his glorious Senate.....after with the arrival of the Byzantines was the dark.

Theodhatus has stayed king of the Hostrogots from the 534 at 536 AD.

ser


Title: Re:COMPETITION FOR TRUE NUMISMATICS
Post by: yafet_rasnal on June 28, 2003, 08:51:07 am
Ser, i think that the top of economy was reached during the co-ruling of Amalasuntha and Teodhatus, but just as consequence of the period going from Teodoricus to the Amalasuntha regency for Athalaricus. Indeed while these first two members of the Amali family are remembered for their culture, Teodhatus is remembered for his cruelty toward not gothic population. I think that Italy was rich just till Teodhatus made her kill.

PS= on the legend the celator wrote TEODAHATUS


Title: Re:COMPETITION FOR TRUE NUMISMATICS
Post by: Rugser on June 28, 2003, 11:02:01 am
Lor

On the coin of ARS CLASSICA  I read THEODAHATVS....

Also ARS CLASSICA write THEODAHATVS.

We Italians tell TEODATO
In English language justly has translated of coin : THEODAHAD..

Do we Know like did they call the Ostrogothics?
Will we never Know which was it the exact phonetics?

Besides, like you will have noticed, the two coins have different engravers. .also their style is different. .and perhaps different also their phonetics.....

ser


Title: Re:COMPETITION FOR TRUE NUMISMATICS
Post by: yafet_rasnal on June 28, 2003, 11:21:44 am
Yes THEODAHATUS...lol....i knew it ...i just mistyped.
We know about the ostrogothic language since we have a complete written book ...the bible of Ulfila. If you are interested i have also the ostrogothic alphabeth....just let me search for it....


Title: Re:COMPETITION FOR TRUE NUMISMATICS
Post by: yafet_rasnal on June 28, 2003, 11:34:31 am
Here's the Ulfila alphabet